From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Mon Jun 18 21:02:37 2007 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Mon, 18 Jun 2007 21:02:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1I0UvL-0006Wm-VD for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Mon, 18 Jun 2007 21:02:36 -0700 Received: from 25.mail-out.ovh.net ([213.186.37.103]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with smtp (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1I0UvI-0006SB-1N for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Mon, 18 Jun 2007 21:02:34 -0700 Received: (qmail 2850 invoked by uid 503); 19 Jun 2007 04:02:41 -0000 Received: (QMFILT: 1.0); 19 Jun 2007 04:02:41 -0000 Received: from b7.ovh.net (HELO mail85.ha.ovh.net) (213.186.33.57) by 25.mail-out.ovh.net with SMTP; 19 Jun 2007 04:02:41 -0000 Received: from b0.ovh.net (HELO queue-out) (213.186.33.50) by b0.ovh.net with SMTP; 19 Jun 2007 04:01:45 -0000 Received: from 211.101-225-89.dsl.completel.net (211.101-225-89.dsl.completel.net [89.225.101.211]) by ssl0.ovh.net (IMP) with HTTP for ; Tue, 19 Jun 2007 06:01:45 +0200 Message-ID: <1182225705.46775529bf211@ssl0.ovh.net> Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2007 06:01:45 +0200 From: m.kornig@sondal.net To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: consonant doubling? References: <1182179984.4676a290aa1b5@ssl0.ovh.net> <1189A858F8918F43BE3F9C7603C73FB4031E7DCE@0456-its-exmp01.us.saic.com> <925d17560706180835w6b83c04fl2a2b6eb61f45c3ce@mail.gmail.com> <1182187693.4676c0add509b@ssl0.ovh.net> <23dc8c770706181507u5fc3575as2eb6c2f38e0215f5@mail.gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <23dc8c770706181507u5fc3575as2eb6c2f38e0215f5@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.2.6 X-Originating-IP: 89.225.101.211 X-Spam-Score: 0.6 X-Spam-Score-Int: 6 X-Spam-Bar: / X-archive-position: 5048 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: m.kornig@sondal.net Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@lojban.org X-list: lojban-beginners Selon Karl Naylor : > On 18/06/07, m.kornig@sondal.net wrote: > > > Oh, I knew about voiced-unvoiced clusters. But I > > didn't know about {sc} and {zj}. I can pronounce > > both of them (even stand-alone, i.e. without a > > vowel). Why would you want to exclude these > > sounds? > > Good for you if you can pronounce those, but not everyone can. I find > myself unable to pronounce {sc} without sounding like {c}, for > instance. The sound could be padded (eg. with a short "i" sound) of > course, but not everyone will do that, and I think many listeners > would be confused as to whether they had heard {c} or {sc}. I believe {c} and {sc} sound very different. But {j} and {dj} don't and are allowed... Martin