From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Thu Jun 21 05:15:10 2007 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Thu, 21 Jun 2007 05:15:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1I1LZ7-0000sF-0v for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Thu, 21 Jun 2007 05:15:09 -0700 Received: from ug-out-1314.google.com ([66.249.92.175]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1I1LZ3-0000rv-Ay for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Thu, 21 Jun 2007 05:15:08 -0700 Received: by ug-out-1314.google.com with SMTP id 78so557797ugn for ; Thu, 21 Jun 2007 05:15:03 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=mnEkFzQsmpudjXyRqfeSZ10H/L1oc56iXmEs5djjz5VqLrEelVpMsl96V9klGvYHHyX/iEYPOTSzDo5w17Ww1cI9aINuonB/HDf1wbhsk06tFIHlNoDB3tOvII4dAlMW4JdXWrMpRkAdxgbwbOUM8z7Uk3dScTsj4cSjuG0Catk= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=OQlGrZE/9RjOpz3UNS01vqqqh2di7LiQtPqiOXCt4Q/aHMQCz3JkJrVIF1Iyb+68TTlNulIcZHJLKncpI6eCbhHpTlX5m14wmf/6OAUub8SshxT5pRP1HBF7GHIKfbUX9n46K5Ukw6Ov6XxjxpwJ9Rsx1gwrNbDPp4ypDQE6YjQ= Received: by 10.82.106.14 with SMTP id e14mr3799734buc.1182428102943; Thu, 21 Jun 2007 05:15:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.82.134.20 with HTTP; Thu, 21 Jun 2007 05:15:02 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <23dc8c770706210515o1a900792oe3e75a18a1176579@mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2007 12:15:02 +0000 From: "Karl Naylor" To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: lojban-beginners Digest V6 #97 In-Reply-To: <1181440772.466b5b046ab10@ssl0.ovh.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: <1181440772.466b5b046ab10@ssl0.ovh.net> X-Spam-Score: -0.0 X-Spam-Score-Int: 0 X-Spam-Bar: / X-archive-position: 5093 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: karl.org@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@lojban.org X-list: lojban-beginners On 10/06/07, m.kornig@sondal.net wrote: > I really hate Lojban for its "lassez-faire" attitude towards > pronunciation. Two vowels (possibly some consonants, the I don't consider Lojban laissez-faire on this matter. Yes, there are multiple acceptable pronunciations for many characters, but this is OK because the acceptable pronunciations are well-defined (nobody should be making up their own pronunciation, only choosing from the alternatives in The Book), and there is no overlap between letters. There are many ways a speaker may pronounce {r}, for example, but none of those ways overlap with the pronunciation-range for any other letter. It seems to me that the existence of pronunciation "ranges" corresponding to letters is more accomodating for speakers of different racial backgrounds, who therefore have differently-shaped vocal equipment and may find some options easier to pronounce than others. If you're worried that listeners may be confused to hear a pronunciation that is correct, yet unfamiliar to them, I think that may happen at first but would be resolved very quickly. In most cases the listener could easily infer what letter is meant (especially since the speaker would presumably pronounce that letter consistently wherever it appears). In extreme cases it may be necessary to ask "wait, what is that sound you keep making?" :)