From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Sun Aug 19 17:19:23 2007 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Sun, 19 Aug 2007 17:19:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1IMuzL-0005B7-0E for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Sun, 19 Aug 2007 17:19:23 -0700 Received: from wx-out-0506.google.com ([66.249.82.233]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1IMuzI-0005Aw-R6 for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Sun, 19 Aug 2007 17:19:22 -0700 Received: by wx-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id i27so1046367wxd for ; Sun, 19 Aug 2007 17:19:14 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=uj+P3bLXoF+udP+DGXoML+uoklI418X2zMpYUR7tMtmDPE9zhxPMQghl/VArlc6fWqRAVF15r4qrk2a0RBfDPZLDuH0xLtoVM/w2I9YyfU/OeIcDG5itUBHQiLMHmncFpGJu+6QEp+ZUOaHXh9pVH189/25hU+w7uFr+Ep7qROo= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=r1mIsHfPTQyQx2FDOmZfLMS2zvaGNaquIbCptxyH6/dOCyjoY0SJSOfZ/xRh0FKTg1Qa1EwucNfACiyZr9opmP7RqDv+DxduO3m0/UAoy0G9elXIgiKuvIU6ADspy8IJwpphcBrNIsxBQ7V6zSrqf5H9KWZMut/18g8ISh30ATI= Received: by 10.70.59.20 with SMTP id h20mr9555497wxa.1187569152361; Sun, 19 Aug 2007 17:19:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.70.91.19 with HTTP; Sun, 19 Aug 2007 17:19:12 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <2f91285f0708191719i2473edcfgcb12dff072a08edd@mail.gmail.com> Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2007 01:19:12 +0100 From: "Vid Sintef" To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: "technology" In-Reply-To: <925d17560708191258w84f9959td9acaa271a282733@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by Ecartis Content-Disposition: inline References: <200708191020.GAA07416@Sparkle.Rodents.Montreal.QC.CA> <2f91285f0708190626w6e287dacw5afc9c3bddc98274@mail.gmail.com> <925d17560708191258w84f9959td9acaa271a282733@mail.gmail.com> X-Spam-Score: 0.1 X-Spam-Score-Int: 1 X-Spam-Bar: / X-archive-position: 5390 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: picos.picos@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@lojban.org X-list: lojban-beginners On 8/19/07, Jorge Llambías wrote: > > Another example would be, > > Braque's "Woman and a guitar" (x1) is an art of cubism (x2). > > The gismu list suggests that x1 is a process, and x2 an activity (or an idea?). > I find that very confusing. A work of art as a process? > Cubism as an activity or idea? IMO... The x2 shouldn't be an activity itself but a "mode" of activity. I dare to read the definition as follows: x1 is an applied body/application of artistic method/mode x2. So, le nu zbasu le vi melbi zdani cu larcu lo nu zbasu lo melbi zdani is not a good statement (or even erroneous) because {lo nu zbasu lo melbi zdani} on the x2 does not specify an artistic mode/method but a mere event of activity. On the other hand, le nu zbasu le vi melbi zdani cu larcu la sidbrgotik (or la'o gy. Gothic gy.) would be fine. > How do we say in Lojban: > > Braque's "Woman and a guitar" is a work of art. > Cubism is a style of painting. > Painting is an art. I would try something like this: la'e lu lo ninmu .e lo jgita li'u ku fi'e la brak. cu larcu (or larcu selfi'i) la kubsi'o cu se larcu co cimsku lo selcimsku cu larcu "This painting is an art of cubism" would be le ti selcimsku cu larcu la kubsi'o / la kubsi'o cu se larcu le ti selcimsku "His activity of painting is artistic (in some unspecified way)" would be le nu ko'a cimsku cu larcu zo'e mu'o mi'e vid