From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Tue Apr 22 10:31:22 2008 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Tue, 22 Apr 2008 10:31:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1JoMKp-0002NV-2h for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2008 10:31:17 -0700 Received: from nf-out-0910.google.com ([64.233.182.189]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1JoMKV-0002MQ-9I for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2008 10:31:13 -0700 Received: by nf-out-0910.google.com with SMTP id 4so722252nfv.46 for ; Tue, 22 Apr 2008 10:30:40 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; bh=NG5/RRbkNfQs6NQP9wgLXoCpXWejPp8v28TAyNzKBLI=; b=yEodxl3vWdGXI/FvCfSms87ZFe2prRIBv3v7VPcpzKrB0CvbBmh8Hfo0gG2IEP1OvGV+JW8uogLQHHjQdsayeSy12rnBS9ntG0Aj/3ReY7BNMn7Nbk0DLzKWPJDxGnx+NdRM0B7CbSMttI1Yi5FfuQmR2xSJGb92UToz5+qPe9k= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=iAFKiD0sdvEnurKf1zy+jCcsuiO+IiZTFhyGWMz48/hzTcPWA5oDxcsDvA2XMVGKXhRooPUogYjhosEq08mD9fxU8GxqE0wRVrgVKgjzf4JPF+na9wL0F8IGA+cdlPu1Pc4xUa7lQwpxBQgglR4cmKPBek/uIP9wWcxVKlohIdI= Received: by 10.86.66.19 with SMTP id o19mr1032812fga.10.1208885440367; Tue, 22 Apr 2008 10:30:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.86.33.18 with HTTP; Tue, 22 Apr 2008 10:30:40 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <925d17560804221030k253afcafp9e11e6d16ea539a3@mail.gmail.com> Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2008 14:30:40 -0300 From: "=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jorge_Llamb=EDas?=" To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: relative phrase within tanru In-Reply-To: <2f91285f0804220926h63f5d474y14dd7ec85c5b2d2a@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by Ecartis Content-Disposition: inline References: <2f91285f0804220829t7733c6bcx3e99fc6be16640ac@mail.gmail.com> <925d17560804220859p6a74e3f3m6416373909e7d576@mail.gmail.com> <2f91285f0804220926h63f5d474y14dd7ec85c5b2d2a@mail.gmail.com> X-Spam-Score: 0.0 X-Spam-Score-Int: 0 X-Spam-Bar: / X-archive-position: 527 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: jjllambias@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@lojban.org X-list: lojban-beginners On 4/22/08, Vid Sintef wrote: > ¿How different are these: > > le melbi mlatu co me do > le melbi mlatu pe do Both {pe} and tanru modification are very vague, but there is a structural difference: The first one is a sumti built from the selbri {melbi mlatu co me do}. This selbri can be predicated of something, and {le} uses this description to get to the intended referent. The second one is built from a sumti {lo melbi mlatu}, whose referents are restricted in some way by the referents of {do}. mu'o mi'e xorxes