From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Mon Jul 21 17:20:46 2008 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Mon, 21 Jul 2008 17:20:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1KL5cU-0002dc-HV for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Mon, 21 Jul 2008 17:20:46 -0700 Received: from wf-out-1314.google.com ([209.85.200.171]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1KL5cR-0002dF-Ny for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Mon, 21 Jul 2008 17:20:46 -0700 Received: by wf-out-1314.google.com with SMTP id 23so1227157wfg.25 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 2008 17:20:42 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:sender :to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references :x-google-sender-auth; bh=GdVwiKNOCZsRtAzVzTTRPzP7LKfV74E18FSG7N0hNiY=; b=fQ2DJ0UmNpRhsNwwJwjh60LxgAdNTZGyaIeRlASX6e5fu6zOvBAO14zNwnZMCr++e2 TKKNj6RtrMjIAvr4RyA6OyMUEsbqXZfYobT7O0e+yQUJmUjWbhP29xzXQTTy8s45VzAr PuG8ebMTcPGLUETdiHLABTDmRlwNVf3QVyrXM= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=message-id:date:from:sender:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version :content-type:references:x-google-sender-auth; b=p8xYP1QJNYOzui1F707Ik7ucwcwh190n6CZOvl6Tv/M3QZ/IwK4FqDY4QdSEBjiJUN JCma0H3cTeqADhYwOIk12Bq0tFD5W7CuCOW4mTtLRd+u+sFBu9z8b6EExEae1DVTMAxg JJsYRnMn9KIEqG2sIxlf/4dXbWcaeuF1D8QdE= Received: by 10.142.47.13 with SMTP id u13mr1588987wfu.38.1216686042829; Mon, 21 Jul 2008 17:20:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.142.50.4 with HTTP; Mon, 21 Jul 2008 17:20:42 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <12d58c160807211720o16c7ab0dn7f6a066b0c9486d2@mail.gmail.com> Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2008 20:20:42 -0400 From: "komfo,amonan" To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: ke'a In-Reply-To: <12d58c160807211705p6cdd29bcocc5d537a3e91cc3f@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_Part_78066_520148.1216686042817" References: <2f91285f0807211642n258bb4d2t9a98c9589c037c60@mail.gmail.com> <12d58c160807211705p6cdd29bcocc5d537a3e91cc3f@mail.gmail.com> X-Google-Sender-Auth: cc60bf9747bfd6cd X-Spam-Score: 0.0 X-Spam-Score-Int: 0 X-Spam-Bar: / X-archive-position: 698 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: komfoamonan@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@lojban.org X-list: lojban-beginners ------=_Part_78066_520148.1216686042817 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline On Mon, Jul 21, 2008 at 7:42 PM, tijlan wrote: > Can {ke'a} safely refer to a sumti which is at a different structure level? > Example: > > le cmene be le prenu poi do stidi le nu mi penmi ke'a > (the name of the man whom you are suggesting I meet) > > ke'a = le prenu ? > Yes. From CLL 8:1: > Of course, there is no reason why ``ke'a'' needs to appear in the x1 place > of a relative clause bridi; it can appear in any place, or indeed even in a > sub-bridi within the relative clause bridi. Here are two more examples: > 1.5) tu poi le mlatu pu lacpu ke'a ku'o cu ratcu That-distant-thing such-that( the cat [past] drags IT ) is-a-rat. That thing which the cat dragged is a rat. What the cat dragged is a rat. 1.6) ta poi mi djica le nu mi ponse ke'a [kei] ku'o cu bloti That-thing such-that( I desire the event-of( I own IT ) ) is-a-boat. mu'o mi'e komfo,amonan ------=_Part_78066_520148.1216686042817 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline
On Mon, Jul 21, 2008 at 7:42 PM, tijlan <picos.picos@gmail.com> wrote:
Can {ke'a} safely refer to a sumti which is at a different structure level? Example:

le cmene be le prenu poi do stidi le nu mi penmi ke'a
(the name of the man whom you are suggesting I meet)

ke'a = le prenu ?

Yes. From CLL 8:1:

Of course, there is no reason why ``ke'a'' needs to appear in the x1 place of a relative clause bridi; it can appear in any place, or indeed even in a sub-bridi within the relative clause bridi. Here are two more examples:

1.5) tu poi le mlatu pu lacpu ke'a ku'o cu ratcu
That-distant-thing such-that( the cat [past] drags IT ) is-a-rat.
That thing which the cat dragged is a rat.
What the cat dragged is a rat.

1.6) ta poi mi djica le nu mi ponse ke'a [kei] ku'o
cu bloti
That-thing such-that( I desire the event-of( I own IT ) ) is-a-boat.
mu'o mi'e komfo,amonan
------=_Part_78066_520148.1216686042817--