From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Mon May 25 18:21:15 2009 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Mon, 25 May 2009 18:21:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1M8lLv-00071w-Hm for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Mon, 25 May 2009 18:21:15 -0700 Received: from cdptpa-omtalb.mail.rr.com ([75.180.132.121]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1M8lLr-00071I-Gh for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Mon, 25 May 2009 18:21:15 -0700 Received: from chausie ([71.75.215.96]) by cdptpa-omta03.mail.rr.com with ESMTP id <20090526012104639.HKUQ28835@cdptpa-omta03.mail.rr.com> for ; Tue, 26 May 2009 01:21:04 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by chausie (Postfix) with ESMTP id E3C5B40B5 for ; Mon, 25 May 2009 21:21:02 -0400 (EDT) From: Pierre Abbat To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: Adjectival predicative Date: Mon, 25 May 2009 21:20:56 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.6 (enterprise 0.20070907.709405) References: <4de8c3930905221412s401d39d4o1137050f283fccca@mail.gmail.com> <96f789a60905251318rc1695d0gc8a6e6409c79e3d6@mail.gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <96f789a60905251318rc1695d0gc8a6e6409c79e3d6@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200905252120.58536.phma@phma.optus.nu> X-archive-position: 1704 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: phma@phma.optus.nu Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@lojban.org X-list: lojban-beginners On Monday 25 May 2009 16:18:40 Michael Turniansky wrote: > I think the problem here is that you refer to an "exclusive relation > between 'the door' and 'white'". But I think that's chimerical. > There is no relationship between the door and white outside of the > action at hand. "White" hasn't anything to do with the door, it has > to do with the act of painting. So either "ko'a blabi cintypu'i le > vorme" or "ko'a cintypu'i le vorme tai lo blabi" (or yes, the > for-some-reason-dreaded-by-you "ko'a cintypu'i le vorme lo blabi"). > Just because a grammatical construct exists in language A doesn't mean > it exists in lojban (like "noun" ;-)) Notice what wikipedia says: > "predicative is an element of the predicate of a sentence which > supplements the subject or object _by means of the verb_" It's part > of the verb, so yes, that's exactly what the sumti places or modals > do. I think the proper constructions are "ko'a simlu lo ka fengu" and "ko'a cintyskagau le vorme lo ka blabi". Pierre