From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Sat Sep 26 05:06:43 2009 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Sat, 26 Sep 2009 05:06:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1MrW30-0000BC-6Z for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Sat, 26 Sep 2009 05:06:42 -0700 Received: from mail-fx0-f225.google.com ([209.85.220.225]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1MrW2v-0000AP-BW for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Sat, 26 Sep 2009 05:06:41 -0700 Received: by fxm25 with SMTP id 25so1196336fxm.0 for ; Sat, 26 Sep 2009 05:06:31 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:in-reply-to:references :date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=YDZULalB0vyvPlMFVXFKiba5XcE73MdL+K4sIsDBDLo=; b=J1ut2b/MT7G0xhet7jQOWYWMfBlkUFzPOsqVM3DegyAIug/Xq8o58+oD61wU4T33y7 2B1HUtR9II6x2OQGl0lbIphvoYSGeHhwn9G+VAR/+Z7M9Iokaatnh6DZ3XLCVURrBHFp jYRynSheNA8QZotaWyD0I1rU9ymUqXvOeQ5DA= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=meyLfInpIKvqLPZIiyI1/l3rOmB5mtxsQXE5BNuAaAGZVqGxjGmQjrQX+Rit2aTsQf xGrQYDZ3ChNp1bzwlgbkSPKVP6QZMbKwJzXb2W1s213hRBVB5kX5IjMSwyCYtBXR7IvO X2lzm10tvG0+kS90a8c363QZ4vWCaSZ5BPYQw= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.223.54.23 with SMTP id o23mr314790fag.72.1253966791004; Sat, 26 Sep 2009 05:06:31 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <4de8c3930909260344q14320a48k239a6248df3766d9@mail.gmail.com> References: <74145aa00909250740s14ae670r4ba0536ea04ccf48@mail.gmail.com> <4de8c3930909251356x52c4b92cld4571097b2564d62@mail.gmail.com> <200909251733.46864.phma@phma.optus.nu> <4de8c3930909260344q14320a48k239a6248df3766d9@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sat, 26 Sep 2009 14:06:30 +0200 Message-ID: Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: =?windows-1252?Q?=91There?= is the view from =?windows-1252?Q?here=92?= question From: Ivo Doko To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by Ecartis X-archive-position: 2418 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: ivo.doko@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@lojban.org X-list: lojban-beginners 2009/9/26 tijlan : > As "be" inserts "vi" into the selbri "jvinu", the construct "be vi" > becomes internal to the selbri, going down to a lower structure level. > "ragve" cannot be part of "be vi" because "be" can only have a term > and "vi ragve" is not a term; so, the construct "be vi" naturally > terminates just before "ragve", with which the sentence comes back to > the upper structure level. On that level, "ragve" is right after > "jvinu", forming a tanru "jvinu [be vi] ragve". And with "le" it > becomes one sumti. > > If you want "ragve" as the main selbri, you want to terminate all > (one, in this case) preceding sumti in the sentence and bring "ragve" > to the uppermost structure level. This can be done with "cu": > >  le jvinu be vi cu ragve fe do > > If you want "do" as the x3, the marker is "fi", not "fe". And, instead > of "be vi", it would be more common to put "vi" before "jvinu", > forming a tag selbri: > >  le vi jvinu cu ragve fi do I see. Thanks. :) Then: le vi jvinu cu ragve fi do it is! :)