From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Sun Nov 01 01:00:43 2009 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Sun, 01 Nov 2009 01:00:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1N4WIk-0007sM-Co for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Sun, 01 Nov 2009 01:00:42 -0800 Received: from mail-bw0-f215.google.com ([209.85.218.215]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1N4WIh-0007pv-2v for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Sun, 01 Nov 2009 01:00:42 -0800 Received: by bwz7 with SMTP id 7so5228637bwz.26 for ; Sun, 01 Nov 2009 01:00:32 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:sender:received:in-reply-to :references:date:x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=uyjQaSRQfYX4pgEah3Dml1wneh6chYqrOt14/jf06v8=; b=K+GqFJaopoaN0KzEw2DWNIUlk0S2HBeHv9LqbcCqn1invnOvYb5bOXK9AWqs5ZXCod kmkN7Oe/jglxuICbpSME8Sxtc+kyAUgo3o5zVQbOrsPwEuzfV5qvakRUcPNUc5xHnLpA zICEUHqTDy3K7R+zJhGLznzt+3PvXaDf2WKSk= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; b=cyjzyxSms/H5N04FJAtUDgp2+K0Z7Rf6ecDnFYgeiXw8dn9WjExFq2uWG/vNxO6/kJ AyrBvseLSo/4OM4n98o9oI5kaECJ+3q/peZ0QajwAMy9VF1JviGzPSpwMWgWBrNp5YCL sHYQW7pIxYKLeaLpQeS5AYWZfEUmEgFGGPqTE= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.223.143.15 with SMTP id s15mr495482fau.77.1257066032291; Sun, 01 Nov 2009 01:00:32 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <200910312012.52632.phma@phma.optus.nu> References: <7f1d42860910311620i4b112481k6243982cd35fffab@mail.gmail.com> <200910312012.52632.phma@phma.optus.nu> Date: Sun, 1 Nov 2009 10:00:32 +0100 X-Google-Sender-Auth: 54723b1e5412c732 Message-ID: <4de8c3930911010100y91da761o7d75cdc0ab769264@mail.gmail.com> Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: Study plan for a quiz- I'd like a second opinion on this one From: tijlan To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by Ecartis X-archive-position: 2513 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: jbotijlan@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@lojban.org X-list: lojban-beginners 2009/11/1 Pierre Abbat : > On Saturday 31 October 2009 19:20:20 Ryan Leach wrote: >> .i do jmive .i do morsi                                      you live, >> and you die > > "morsi" actually means "to be dead", not "to die", which is "mrobi'o" (usual) > or "co'amro" (as opposed to "co'umro", la .iecu,ax gasnu lenu la ly,zar. > co'umro). Some languages don't have adjectives, and i wonder how would speakers of those languages interpret "morsi" in contrast to "mrobi'o". I'm of the opinion that words like "badri" can be considered as either an adjective or a verb, respectively corresponding to e.g. the Japanese "kanashi-i" and "kanashi-mu", to the English "(to be) sad" and "(to) lament", to the Esperanto "(esti) trista" and "tristi", and so on (Japanese adjectives does not require a copula like English and Esperanto do, so they can be truly verb-less predicates). Some time ago i suggested "za'i badri" and "zu'o badri" as a pseudo adjective and a pseudo verb that could be used to specify those nat-lang-ish senses of this otherwise hermaphrodite jbo-predicate (along which i suggested also that NU be able to take words like "mi" as its x1, ready for expressions like "mi zu'o badri"). In the same vein, i doubt the perceived necessity for "morsi" to be restricted to mean the adjectival "to be dead". In fact, the Chinese "死 (si)" (from which a part of "morsi" comes) does not distinguish between "to be dead" and "to die" (and i believe it's the same in other languages like the South American Guarani,). >> .i lo virnu cu se jmive do                                   bravery >> is the standard by which you live >> .i lo virnu cu seljmive do                                   bravery >> is the standard by which you live (2) > > I think the "standard of living" in x2 of "jmive" is like "brain" > in "brain-dead". Would you need "tu'a" before "lo besna"? mu'o mi'e tijlan