From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Mon Nov 02 08:41:37 2009 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Mon, 02 Nov 2009 08:41:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1N4zyK-0008Cv-RC for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Mon, 02 Nov 2009 08:41:37 -0800 Received: from cluster-f.mailcontrol.com ([85.115.62.190]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1N4zyE-0008Bt-JO for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Mon, 02 Nov 2009 08:41:36 -0800 Received: from aeacus.blackpool.gov.uk (aeacus.blackpool.gov.uk [195.188.21.21]) by rly07f.srv.mailcontrol.com (MailControl) with ESMTP id nA2GewUn028598 for ; Mon, 2 Nov 2009 16:41:25 GMT x-mimeole: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01CA5BDA.9E4295D4" Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: Study plan for a quiz- I'd like a second opinion on this one Date: Mon, 2 Nov 2009 16:36:24 -0000 Message-ID: <9DE5DB0988ED6C448E606734F5030D3822C1A9E9@bbcmbmx01.blackpool.gov.uk> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [lojban-beginners] Re: Study plan for a quiz- I'd like a second opinion on this one Thread-Index: Acpb2fyxWDYnxmQxShqp3uygXkAfiwAAENKw From: "Michael Eaton" To: X-Scanned-By: MailControl A-09-22-03 (www.mailcontrol.com) on 10.70.0.117 X-archive-position: 2533 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: michael.eaton@blackpool.gov.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@lojban.org X-list: lojban-beginners This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01CA5BDA.9E4295D4 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Not entirely. "Has been dead" is one of those syntactically bizarre phrases= that Lojban is designed to avoid. It's not implicit, but the syntax leans = towards "was at one time dead, but is no longer dead". "Was and is still de= ad" is, rather more simply, "dead". -----Original Message----- From: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org [mailto:lojban-beginners-bounce@lo= jban.org]On Behalf Of Steven Lytle Sent: 02 November 2009 16:29 To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: Study plan for a quiz- I'd like a second op= inion on this one "Has been dead" means "was and is still dead". stevo 2009/11/1 Jorge Llamb=EDas < jjllambias@gmail.com> On Sun, Nov 1, 2009 at 12:53 PM, tijlan < jbotijlan@gmail.com> wrote: > > da ca co'i morsi (One dies.) > da ca ba'o morsi (One is dead.) That would work if "morsi" meant "dies" (a change of state, goes from being alive to being dead) rather than "is dead" (a state). "ba'o morsi" means "has been dead" (i.e., it is no longer dead), not "has died" (it is no longer dying). Compare with "sipna", which is more likely than "morsi" to be used with "ba'o". "ba'o sipna" means "has been asleep", not "has fallen asleep". "Falls asleep" is "sipybi'o" or "co'a sipna", and "dies" is "mrobi'o" or "co'a morsi". "co'i sipna" and "co'i morsi" are complete events of sleeping, or of being dead. The difference is that events of being dead don't usually ever end, so its unlikely that one would speak of "ba'o morsi", "having been dead", except in some very special contexts. mu'o mi'e xorxes http://www.blackpool.gov.uk/EmailDisclaimer/ This message has been scanned for inappropriate or malicious content as par= t of the Council's e-mail and Internet policies. =20 Click here t= o report this email as spam. http://www.blackpool.gov.uk/EmailDisclaimer/ This message has been scanned for inappropriate or malicious content as par= t of the Council's e-mail and Internet policies. ***************************************************************************= ***See the Blackpool You Tube video aimed at attracting French visitors by = clicking this link http://www.visitblackpool.com/jetaime ******************= ************************************************************ ------_=_NextPart_001_01CA5BDA.9E4295D4 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Not entirely. "Has been dead" is one of those syntactically bizarr= e=20 phrases that Lojban is designed to avoid. It's not implicit, but t= he=20 syntax leans towards "was at one time dead, but is no longer dead". "Was an= d is=20 still dead" is, rather more simply, "dead".
-----Original Message-----
From:=20 lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org=20 [mailto:lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org]On Behalf Of Steven=20 Lytle
Sent: 02 November 2009 16:29
To:=20 lojban-beginners@lojban.org
Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: Stu= dy=20 plan for a quiz- I'd like a second opinion on this one
"Has been dead" means "was and is still dead".
stevo

2009/11/1 Jorge Llamb=EDas <jjllambias@gmail.com>
On Sun, Nov 1, 2009 at 12:53 PM, tijlan <jbotijlan@gmail.com>=20 wrote:
>
>  da ca co'i morsi (One dies.)
>  = ;da=20 ca ba'o morsi (One is dead.)

That would work if "morsi" me= ant=20 "dies" (a change of state, goes from
being alive to being dead) rath= er=20 than "is dead" (a state).

"ba'o morsi" means "has been dead" (i.= e.,=20 it is no longer dead), not
"has died" (it is no longer=20 dying).

Compare with "sipna", which is more likely than "morsi" = to be=20 used
with "ba'o". "ba'o sipna" means "has been asleep", not "has=20 fallen
asleep". "Falls asleep" is "sipybi'o" or "co'a sipna", and "d= ies"=20 is
"mrobi'o" or "co'a morsi". "co'i sipna" and "co'i morsi" are=20 complete
events of sleeping, or of being dead. The difference is tha= t=20 events of
being dead don't usually ever end, so its unlikely that on= e=20 would
speak of "ba'o morsi", "having been dead", except in some very= =20 special
contexts.

mu'o mi'e=20 xorxes






http://www.blackpoo= l.gov.uk/EmailDisclaimer/

This message has been scanned for inappropriate or malicious content a= s=20 part of the Council's e-mail and Internet policies.

 

Click here= =20 to report this email as spam.



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This message has been scanned fo= r inappropriate or malicious content as part of the Council's e-mail and In= ternet policies.

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