From get.oren@gmail.com Wed Jan 27 20:04:11 2010 Received: from mail-pz0-f185.google.com ([209.85.222.185]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1NaLbx-0005Hb-3W for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Wed, 27 Jan 2010 20:04:11 -0800 Received: by pzk15 with SMTP id 15so211752pzk.25 for ; Wed, 27 Jan 2010 20:03:59 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:in-reply-to:references :from:date:message-id:subject:to:content-type; bh=S56RgEKQd+uh7ELFxw/s+/mHECtncqd6NretbLtCdKY=; b=xFR7sv5ZTnoOILN+TId8z84DxaP6ccRn1IkP7unJed6JiZKwUV7jkZK7k/nJU19TQO WV1Lc4vOupq4yLf0NSL9SkL4BRTcKTQVuUjvaNjWemOJ95Jl8l0Syj8o9Laipx5TlsDf uNm1EUQudq+2QB6Ay4eOFEY5TahO1wJjOQGFU= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :content-type; b=hMtN62KxiDLgKyqkTZHB3Ig09sTpUUKLvAzS/gAcJQTIV/JFV1wLKV1M9tIXbie1S2 to++jF4uKkRR34eI36qoW84+qh+OMGq50/eVqTA7fU0MxuLBsRgNWzw7PrQuD/INXTxr BSnjaDIzve8ag3VAow84ty0tBUdoUIFJ4t/nE= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.142.149.36 with SMTP id w36mr3373414wfd.328.1264651439176; Wed, 27 Jan 2010 20:03:59 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <27513e551001272000n5040fe9xb88513608b33ab35@mail.gmail.com> References: <7177e42e1001271849o782ec540td05bdd005d247b09@mail.gmail.com> <1a3d02c41001271924i1a48cefq8cf87704a7abc24c@mail.gmail.com> <27513e551001272000n5040fe9xb88513608b33ab35@mail.gmail.com> From: Oren Date: Thu, 28 Jan 2010 12:03:39 +0800 Message-ID: <27513e551001272003x175268ebjc61323a8f40e403b@mail.gmail.com> Subject: Re: [lojban-beginners] Re: "Why should I believe that?" To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=000e0cd28db0cbfcd4047e319bc8 --000e0cd28db0cbfcd4047e319bc8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 *du'i => di'u On Thu, Jan 28, 2010 at 12:00, Oren wrote: > could I rearrange the sumti and say... > > { fe la'edu'i jinvi fo ma } > > ...to mean "why believe that?" (without specifying me or you or whoever) > > On Thu, Jan 28, 2010 at 11:24, Sam Chapin wrote: > >> For a start there's {jinvi}, "opine": x1 holds opinion x2 (du'u) about >> subject x3 for reason x4. >> >> >> http://www.lojban.org/cgi-bin/dict.pl?Form=dict.pl1&Query=jinvi&Strategy=*&Database=*&submit=Submit+query >> >> On Wed, Jan 27, 2010 at 9:49 PM, DataPacRat wrote: >> >>> "Why should I believe that?" is a fairly simple phrase, and the >>> cornerstone of the scientific method and skeptical movement... and I'm >>> having a bit of a time figuring out the Lojban version. The most >>> relevant lujvo or gismu I can find dealing with belief is krici, which >>> is belief /without/ evidence or proof, the exact opposite of the sort >>> of belief I want to deal with. Another way to say the same idea in >>> English is "What evidence supports that [assertion]?", but I'm having >>> trouble figuring out the different lujvo; would >>> >>> ma xu'acmu fi ta >>> >>> translate to something like "What evidence is the basis for asserting >>> that?" >>> >>> Or should I be trying to figure out "velji'i datni" or "sidydatni" >>> mentioned in the entry for datni? >>> >>> >>> Thank you for your time, >>> -- >>> DataPacRat >>> li te'o te'a vei pai pi'i ka'o ve'o su'i pa du li no .i je'a melbi! >>> >>> >>> >>> >> > --000e0cd28db0cbfcd4047e319bc8 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
*du'i =3D> di'u

On Thu, Jan 28, 2010 at 12:00, Oren <get.oren@gmail.com> wrote:
could I rearrange the sumti and say...

= { fe la'edu'i jinvi fo ma }

...to mean &qu= ot;why believe that?" (without specifying me or you or whoever)

On Thu, Jan 28, 2010 at 11:24, Sam Chap= in <not.here.now@gmail.com> wrote:
For a start there's {jinvi}, "opine": x1 holds opinion x= 2 (du'u) about subject x3 for reason x4.


On Wed, Jan 27, 2010 at 9:49 PM, D= ataPacRat <datapacrat@gmail.com> wrote:
"Why should I believe that?" is a fairly simple phrase, and the cornerstone of the scientific method and skeptical movement... and I'm<= br> having a bit of a time figuring out the Lojban version. The most
relevant lujvo or gismu I can find dealing with belief is krici, which
is belief /without/ evidence or proof, the exact opposite of the sort
of belief I want to deal with. Another way to say the same idea in
English is "What evidence supports that [assertion]?", but I'= m having
trouble figuring out the different lujvo; would

ma xu'acmu fi ta

translate to something like "What evidence is the basis for asserting = that?"

Or should I be trying to figure out "velji'i datni" or "= sidydatni"
mentioned in the entry for datni?


Thank you for your time,
--
DataPacRat
li te'o te'a vei pai pi'i ka'o ve'o su'i pa du li n= o .i je'a melbi!






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