From lojban-beginners+bncCJrK5PGGEBD35IzkBBoECUzoyw@googlegroups.com Sat Sep 04 23:03:10 2010 Received: from mail-gw0-f61.google.com ([74.125.83.61]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1Os8Jm-0007Y5-E1; Sat, 04 Sep 2010 23:03:09 -0700 Received: by gwb11 with SMTP id 11sf4577715gwb.16 for ; Sat, 04 Sep 2010 23:02:59 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:x-beenthere:received:received:received :received:received:received-spf:received:received:received:from :organization:to:subject:date:user-agent:mime-version:content-type :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:x-interia-antivirus:x-emid :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe; bh=YIyo43aFXFee7lE5GxqiK5CVE/730N2rDk7hDS9ZpbM=; b=Rdhst+z/hEc4ZboycvA+p+Fc2MqobBUsUWL+A/x8bK+HL8ZS3oPk64aSYLN2UYjs+8 p+UBboClZZclEqTeduAfYREJhgBccHFZ1GK28nBi0DtaViFf2jtP0dCEQiHl08QQfLzC xhcy06shlJ6aFwypC4aTBsnuY9xt5YvnT7+xY= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:from:organization:to:subject:date :user-agent:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding :message-id:x-interia-antivirus:x-emid:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe; b=tkWzw+dL6cdtmGKS24fUbMqvtcwkCOirGPrjKQ2VoKviQ0fCSRKLldmbSZxt5aeAWs +Dq1OhbZAaOdmUi40iCZrGNrVwfMpZ2fKYxAoGrM/Rx+6WZN7shDEQYqTuACfGpgHhco PsXDh0vTJFkc2R3U+8y3d4693Ah8DWZBpahw4= Received: by 10.90.217.17 with SMTP id p17mr494118agg.2.1283666551394; Sat, 04 Sep 2010 23:02:31 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.151.130.13 with SMTP id h13ls1146702ybn.2.p; Sat, 04 Sep 2010 23:02:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.150.147.6 with SMTP id u6mr883807ybd.57.1283666550664; Sat, 04 Sep 2010 23:02:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.204.45.207 with SMTP id g15mr84289bkf.3.1283626092960; Sat, 04 Sep 2010 11:48:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.204.45.207 with SMTP id g15mr84288bkf.3.1283626092926; Sat, 04 Sep 2010 11:48:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtpo.poczta.interia.pl (smtpo.poczta.interia.pl [217.74.65.205]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id z17si1819531bkb.7.2010.09.04.11.48.12; Sat, 04 Sep 2010 11:48:12 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of jezuch@interia.pl designates 217.74.65.205 as permitted sender) client-ip=217.74.65.205; Received: by smtpo.poczta.interia.pl (INTERIA.PL, from userid 502) id 61B88102CD53; Sat, 4 Sep 2010 20:48:12 +0200 (CEST) Received: from zx-spectrum-1 (c204.idd156.nettete.pl [77.79.204.156]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by poczta.interia.pl (INTERIA.PL) with ESMTPSA for ; Sat, 4 Sep 2010 20:48:09 +0200 (CEST) Received: from jezuch by zx-spectrum-1 with local (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1Orxt4-0005Q0-Bp for lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com; Sat, 04 Sep 2010 20:54:50 +0200 From: Krzysztof Sobolewski Organization: Sobole To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com Subject: [lojban-beginners] ko curmi le nu mi ninpengau do mi Date: Sat, 4 Sep 2010 20:54:45 +0200 User-Agent: KMail/1.13.5 (Linux/2.6.33.7; KDE/4.4.5; x86_64; ; ) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="nextPart2575609.Ss8yYr6ybm"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <201009042054.50156.jezuch@interia.pl> X-Interia-Antivirus: OK X-EMID: d3648acc X-Original-Sender: jezuch@interia.pl X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of jezuch@interia.pl designates 217.74.65.205 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=jezuch@interia.pl Reply-To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com; contact lojban-beginners+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , --nextPart2575609.Ss8yYr6ybm Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable zo'o ko xamgu lo cnino jbopre (Is there a better word that I could use instead of "xamgu" here?) But first things first... mi'e la kcyctof. sobolefskis. no'u la iezux. I've been learning lojban quietly for some time now, but I finally realized= that learning a language without anyone to speak to is, well, silly ;) Esp= ecially that I, just like every newbie, have some questions and I need some= one to answer them ;) So let me start with this one: What does actually "cilre" mean? The official definition is: x1 learns x2 (du'u) about subject x3 from source x4 (obj./event) by method = x5 (event/process) But this looks very unlike "learn" as it is understood in my language (one = of the Slavic family ;) ) where you can learn something (or be learning som= ething) and that's it. The definition above seems to be "polluted" by the E= nglish meaning of "learn", according to which you can say e.g. "I learned t= oday that the road is closed". I ask this mainly because this makes me very= uneasy when I say: mi cilre fi la lojban. Is it OK, or should I rather say: mi tadni la lojban. Or am I too picky? ;) =2D-=20 Ecce Jezuch "There can be but better ways from yesterdays to me Somewhere there are better days for better ways to be Sunny days have funny ways of quieting the roar Is it still a belessed thing to live and live some more?" - D. Pinnick --nextPart2575609.Ss8yYr6ybm Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.10 (GNU/Linux) iEYEABECAAYFAkyClfYACgkQy0fq9RM+TxgyJACfTGSVQ2DMccvotVyql77colUZ 2CMAoM3Xsxd6L8Ip5rbKZPPYOt560c/9 =R/Qi -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --nextPart2575609.Ss8yYr6ybm--