From lojban-beginners+bncCNCCoMTMDhCOo6HkBBoEAZJDRA@googlegroups.com Wed Sep 08 20:17:04 2010 Received: from mail-ww0-f61.google.com ([74.125.82.61]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1OtXdE-0003z4-Ka; Wed, 08 Sep 2010 20:17:04 -0700 Received: by wwe15 with SMTP id 15sf122460wwe.16 for ; Wed, 08 Sep 2010 20:16:53 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:x-beenthere:received:received:received :received:received-spf:received:received:mime-version:received :in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=OFqXBVHF3oNryJEYaVzndCcnw653AqN7f8ZqGtSUx44=; b=HvkcZuvYZ4c81kzYbN4Aoaav2jYl9rp2aP1MwEkSVLNQL9TItsfLVeEsDQvW9pEBf3 4aj1H6ietXCtrTG1NsjAEK+yGx2PYE+zLpRd26pZ9uT40zU8itDyZngGdpw8P2Xa6vYP Kj9Hi6tt37APnM2I98TL6V7v0lyGeIPR7GztE= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from :date:message-id:subject:to:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type; b=VPEruO7sIkFnttgtLmK5caKv77yV28goCHFzGPx0rVx3BmV7Xdc8JCy7NAQ9vrOuzh Jf+fmwd9DfxEz4NdmBn8ceQ/m98g2IW0BF28HrCC8sIaWlDeyLfHap5kn7lTsd+jdI2V HwBaXnsbjnTOvvRLMnps0THJ2viJUYoWrBSMs= Received: by 10.216.145.9 with SMTP id o9mr1389541wej.0.1284002190055; Wed, 08 Sep 2010 20:16:30 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.227.92.203 with SMTP id s11ls2296696wbm.1.p; Wed, 08 Sep 2010 20:16:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.227.136.68 with SMTP id q4mr307326wbt.17.1284002188830; Wed, 08 Sep 2010 20:16:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.227.136.68 with SMTP id q4mr307325wbt.17.1284002188804; Wed, 08 Sep 2010 20:16:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wy0-f179.google.com (mail-wy0-f179.google.com [74.125.82.179]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id q13si264887wbs.0.2010.09.08.20.16.27; Wed, 08 Sep 2010 20:16:27 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of selckiku@gmail.com designates 74.125.82.179 as permitted sender) client-ip=74.125.82.179; Received: by mail-wy0-f179.google.com with SMTP id 32so981820wyb.24 for ; Wed, 08 Sep 2010 20:16:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.227.153.15 with SMTP id i15mr125469wbw.211.1284002187244; Wed, 08 Sep 2010 20:16:27 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.227.149.67 with HTTP; Wed, 8 Sep 2010 20:15:57 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <59ca95ff-dab4-4899-97b6-d26dd2352de5@l20g2000yqe.googlegroups.com> References: <59ca95ff-dab4-4899-97b6-d26dd2352de5@l20g2000yqe.googlegroups.com> From: Stela Selckiku Date: Wed, 8 Sep 2010 23:15:57 -0400 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban-beginners] About reading speed of lojban text. Compared with natlang's text. To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: selckiku@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of selckiku@gmail.com designates 74.125.82.179 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=selckiku@gmail.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com; contact lojban-beginners+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 On Mon, Sep 6, 2010 at 3:50 PM, spermwhale.warrior wrote: > > My question is the following : are you able, to read the lojban piece > of text speedier than or as speedily as the chosen natlang piece of > text ? I'm one of the most fluent speakers here, but I'm not actually fluent at all. I often say that if I were in an actual Lojbanistan where Lojban was everyone's native language, I would be outmatched in many ways by the average five year old. I read Lojban much much more slowly than I can read in English, especially if the text has many lujvo. (These days I am to the point where I'll tend to recognize the rafsi in an unfamiliar lujvo, but usually only after a moment of thought.) I am quite sure that this is my fault and not Lojban's. My difficulty isn't in the grammar, it's just in recognizing vocabulary, which is the same problem in Lojban as in any language. It simply takes a very long time to learn a large amount of vocabulary. We're all foreign language students of Lojban, and none of us have had any actual immersion in the language. So I can tell you about what it's like to speak Lojban, but not really what it's like to speak it natively or fluently. Check back with me in a few years! I'm still working hard at developing actual fluency. > Does lojban's preciseness and accuracy towards semantic content of its > constructs make it inherently long-winded ? Not at all. Lojban is very flexible, so you can speak in a wide variety of styles. Formal Lojban tends to be very long-winded and precise, but the casual Lojban you'll encounter in places like IRC is especially terse and vague. mi'e la stela selckiku mu'o -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.