From lojban-beginners+bncCMHEmaCOBhDJtc7oBBoEOEQ9jg@googlegroups.com Thu Dec 23 10:54:21 2010 Received: from mail-gx0-f189.google.com ([209.85.161.189]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1PVqIp-0002Ru-U5; Thu, 23 Dec 2010 10:54:21 -0800 Received: by gxk19 with SMTP id 19sf6088534gxk.16 for ; Thu, 23 Dec 2010 10:54:10 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:x-beenthere:received:received:received :received:received-spf:received:mime-version:received:received :in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=DAujYyYV9xWGehZKLUQgDmkNu2HyTtyc4xwV+YqT3iA=; b=TJ6DSnwpMillwd24A6zxcL1SCT1d09itouuBqtptJm/VFihsHZjS/Y73KBCsLX7niN rX8vCzsV1qcXo/XwdLqQUFGdYE2zMsDMar/9GFgGNiSKwjW8m/r7Df/VMV+p9wfTKrGk KCI9zZ4hb28FrWUITr5zNMtGHi1gjJNL1hiO0= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type; b=SZnHoboHAgDB9AtUNZUAE+iFTwBKrN7ZZo/vbH9YkFCbrLeJA9/1np9kTEEMKUqfy9 NDXi+h2xKaogFf4BuGYcrNJEMDQnaf6OYdNrHLb16qz4TPWGrMIue5Aqj4tDhOTrGu7a S9tbUZPPhCYaFdihB46BiUAwL9tJxtyFMKGMM= Received: by 10.150.72.6 with SMTP id u6mr775682yba.46.1293130441516; Thu, 23 Dec 2010 10:54:01 -0800 (PST) X-BeenThere: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.231.78.146 with SMTP id l18ls3908165ibk.1.p; Thu, 23 Dec 2010 10:54:00 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.42.180.71 with SMTP id bt7mr568328icb.90.1293130440885; Thu, 23 Dec 2010 10:54:00 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.42.180.71 with SMTP id bt7mr568327icb.90.1293130440844; Thu, 23 Dec 2010 10:54:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-iy0-f175.google.com (mail-iy0-f175.google.com [209.85.210.175]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id c4si1052044ict.3.2010.12.23.10.53.59; Thu, 23 Dec 2010 10:53:59 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of eyeonus@gmail.com designates 209.85.210.175 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.210.175; Received: by iyj18 with SMTP id 18so5352710iyj.34 for ; Thu, 23 Dec 2010 10:53:59 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.231.12.8 with SMTP id v8mr8396009ibv.147.1293130439628; Thu, 23 Dec 2010 10:53:59 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.231.206.146 with HTTP; Thu, 23 Dec 2010 10:53:59 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <201012222138.03564.phma@phma.optus.nu> References: <201012222138.03564.phma@phma.optus.nu> Date: Thu, 23 Dec 2010 11:53:59 -0700 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban-beginners] taxonomic .a descriptive From: Jonathan Jones To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: eyeonus@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of eyeonus@gmail.com designates 209.85.210.175 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=eyeonus@gmail.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com; contact lojban-beginners+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=0022152d7f8d8098ba04981864c2 --0022152d7f8d8098ba04981864c2 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 On Wed, Dec 22, 2010 at 7:38 PM, Pierre Abbat wrote: > On Wednesday 22 December 2010 20:10:17 Jonathan Jones wrote: > > I have recently been thinking about a subject about which, in the past, I > > have been very vocal about, that being Lojban names for various species. > At > > this time, there are basically two ways we do things, which I refer to as > > taxonomic, i.e. basing the lojban name upon the Linnaean (did I spell > that > > right?) name, such as {bramlatu la.*acinonyx.jubatus.*} (big-cat of > species > > *Acinonyx jubatus)*, and descriptive, i.e. basing the name on it's > > distinguishing characteristics, such as {bramlatu la traji sutra} > > (basically - big-cat of species "The Fastest"), both of which are what we > > call, in English, the Cheetah. > > There is a third way, which is to make a fu'ivla from some natlang (or two, > in > the case of "makpapi"). Many common names in natlangs (especially Romance > languages) are related to the Linnaean name, in which case two approaches > may > result in the same Lojban word. E.g. "cipnrfalko" and "falkoni" could be > from > the genus name "Falco" or from any of several natlang descendants of the > Latin word. > Falcon, yes? > > So, the poll is, what is your personal preference for species' names, > and > > why? Do you prefer taxonomic, descriptive, neither both, either depending > > on circumstances, etc. etc., and what are your reasons? > > All three, including having all of them for some living things, such > as "arxokuna" (from some rindo bangu), "prokiono", and "lumge'u" (although > it's not in the dog family, nor in the bear family, despite the similar > German word). > I have absolutely no idea what animal any of those words refer to. > > Please do not be afraid to speak up, because the point of this is to get > a > > reading of the community. I am very curious, and the more of you who > answer > > - and the more detailed your answer is - the happier I will be, even if > the > > majority opinion is decidedly opposite of my own (, which is part of the > > reason why I have been careful to avoid expressing mine in this message.) > > > > Also, I would love to see other examples of Lojban names for things, such > > as, if anyone has another idea for what to call a Cheetah, or a > Red-tailed > > Hawk (which is actually a buzzard, I recently learned), or any other > > creature. > > I call it "ja'urtirxu", as it is a big cat with markings with something > different about its claws (though they are not immobile, despite the genus > name). Don't know about the red-tailed hawk. > > Pierre > -- > Jews use a lunisolar calendar; Muslims use a solely lunar calendar. > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Lojban Beginners" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com > . > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en. > > -- mu'o mi'e .aionys. .i.a'o.e'e ko cmima le bende pe lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D ) -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en. --0022152d7f8d8098ba04981864c2 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

On Wed, Dec 22, 2010 at 7:38 PM, Pierre = Abbat <phma@phma= .optus.nu> wrote:
On Wednesday 22 December 2010 20:10:17 Jonathan Jones wro= te:
> I have recently been thinking about a subject about which, in the past= , I
> have been very vocal about, that being Lojban names for various specie= s. At
> this time, there are basically two ways we do things, which I refer to= as
> taxonomic, i.e. basing the lojban name upon the Linnaean (did I spell = that
> right?) name, such as {bramlatu la.*acinonyx.jubatus.*} (big-cat of sp= ecies
> *Acinonyx jubatus)*, and descriptive, i.e. basing the name on it's=
> distinguishing characteristics, such as {bramlatu la traji sutra}
> (basically - big-cat of species "The Fastest"), both of whic= h are what we
> call, in English, the Cheetah.

There is a third way, which is to make a fu'ivla from some natlan= g (or two, in
the case of "makpapi"). Many common names in natlangs (especially= Romance
languages) are related to the Linnaean name, in which case two approaches m= ay
result in the same Lojban word. E.g. "cipnrfalko" and "falko= ni" could be from
the genus name "Falco" or from any of several natlang descendants= of the
Latin word.

Falcon, yes?
=A0
> So, the poll is, what is your personal preference for species' nam= es, and
> why? Do you prefer taxonomic, descriptive, neither both, either depend= ing
> on circumstances, etc. etc., and what are your reasons?

All three, including having all of them for some living things, such<= br> as "arxokuna" (from some rindo bangu), "prokiono", and = "lumge'u" (although
it's not in the dog family, nor in the bear family, despite the similar=
German word).

I have absolutely no idea what anima= l any of those words refer to.
=A0
> Please do not be afraid to speak up, because the point of this is to g= et a
> reading of the community. I am very curious, and the more of you who a= nswer
> - and the more detailed your answer is - the happier I will be, even i= f the
> majority opinion is decidedly opposite of my own (, which is part of t= he
> reason why I have been careful to avoid expressing mine in this messag= e.)
>
> Also, I would love to see other examples of Lojban names for things, s= uch
> as, if anyone has another idea for what to call a Cheetah, or a Red-ta= iled
> Hawk (which is actually a buzzard, I recently learned), or any other > creature.

I call it "ja'urtirxu", as it is a big cat with marking= s with something
different about its claws (though they are not immobile, despite the genus<= br> name). Don't know about the red-tailed hawk.

Pierre
--
Jews use a lunisolar calendar; Muslims use a solely lunar calendar.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups &= quot;Lojban Beginners" group.
To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegr= oups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/g= roup/lojban-beginners?hl=3Den.




--
mu'o mi'= e .aionys.

.i.a'o.e'e ko cmima le bende pe lo pilno be denpa= bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o
(Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am y= our father. :D )

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= Lojban Beginners" group.
To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@= googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= -beginners?hl=3Den.
--0022152d7f8d8098ba04981864c2--