From lojban-beginners+bncCIycn8S8DhC-qvvqBBoE-6lpAA@googlegroups.com Fri Feb 18 12:23:49 2011 Received: from mail-vw0-f61.google.com ([209.85.212.61]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1PqWrg-0006SP-D4; Fri, 18 Feb 2011 12:23:48 -0800 Received: by vws1 with SMTP id 1sf241183vws.16 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2011 12:23:37 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version :in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=rLV4KODc2NoCj16K+DiWZYKLyiGa05CevYSfxHpJUo0=; b=bRKNg9Wj6aWh+yGvM5edLu1QdP8epIDTl4xLt0TN1WgUSXo7r08tPuuVIq6AeUc0mA bIg9EvUVWlgIvSxWxb8fI69kNOUBEnUDFhEKaBwztv5U/a3EVOKWHTj3jF9LB1rahQn5 SiqtjcCawz00zxVLqpcXilOK31DXmKjTQc74Q= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type; b=tx31hFb1NH6qTqd+o8hBbJc59s2plDmeoQFshQvDGsKbN9UG+PjosamZ67Xmp8wE0X GNiSKrV3nfe2KMLblQci6wMR7tO/eTERi0mJqRzcBwZ9wNFSPj2SIj7bKzbbh+Hc+0Ot 56PfFxZ8eVUIUbO3z0zLuVzUSRgPsg470mKEU= Received: by 10.220.195.10 with SMTP id ea10mr14974vcb.43.1298060606715; Fri, 18 Feb 2011 12:23:26 -0800 (PST) X-BeenThere: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.220.109.137 with SMTP id j9ls608275vcp.0.p; Fri, 18 Feb 2011 12:23:25 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.220.87.20 with SMTP id u20mr30734vcl.16.1298060605736; Fri, 18 Feb 2011 12:23:25 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.220.87.20 with SMTP id u20mr30733vcl.16.1298060605714; Fri, 18 Feb 2011 12:23:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-qy0-f179.google.com (mail-qy0-f179.google.com [209.85.216.179]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id e4si433827vcx.4.2011.02.18.12.23.25 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Fri, 18 Feb 2011 12:23:25 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of mturniansky@gmail.com designates 209.85.216.179 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.216.179; Received: by qyk7 with SMTP id 7so378938qyk.17 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2011 12:23:25 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.224.29.8 with SMTP id o8mr1064315qac.193.1298060605156; Fri, 18 Feb 2011 12:23:25 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.229.73.148 with HTTP; Fri, 18 Feb 2011 12:23:25 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: <201102171403.40004.phma@phma.optus.nu> <201102171622.02738.phma@phma.optus.nu> Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2011 15:23:25 -0500 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban-beginners] Question about {roda} From: Michael Turniansky To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: mturniansky@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of mturniansky@gmail.com designates 209.85.216.179 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=mturniansky@gmail.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com; contact lojban-beginners+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=0015175ce014446fb8049c9449ef --0015175ce014446fb8049c9449ef Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 On Fri, Feb 18, 2011 at 3:03 PM, Oleksii Melnyk wrote: > > > 2011/2/18 Michael Turniansky > > > If they are not qualified with NOI or GOI, or some other mechanism, "ro >> da" MUST refer to everything, >> > > As there are almost no bridi, that can be true about *every*thing (with the > strong "every"), "roda" is useless. So, we should deduce, that one, used > unrestricted "roda", have elided some "poi", just like it usually does with > unspoken sumtis, UIs, etc. > No, they can and should be used to make existential claims, syllogisms, etc. Remember the "logji" part of "lojban"? roda su'ode zo'u ganai da taxfu gi de ka'e dasni da (true or false, the claim "everything that is a garment must be potentially wearable by something" is an example where roda has its intended use) --gejyspa -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en. --0015175ce014446fb8049c9449ef Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
=A0

On Fri, Feb 18, 2011 at 3:03 PM, Oleksii Melnyk = <lamelnyk@gmail.= com> wrote:


2011/2/18 Michael Turniansky &= lt;mturniansky@g= mail.com>=20


If they are not qualified with NOI or GOI, or some other m= echanism,=A0"ro da" MUST refer to everything,
<= /div>

As there are almost no bridi, that can be true about *every*thing = (with the strong "every"), "roda" is useless. So, we sh= ould deduce, that one, used unrestricted "roda", have elided some= "poi", just like it usually does with unspoken sumtis, UIs, etc.=
=A0 No, they can and should be used to make existential claims, syllog= isms, etc.=A0 Remember the "logji" part of "lojban"?
=A0
=A0 roda su'ode zo'u ganai da=A0 taxfu gi de ka'e dasni da=
(true or false, the claim "everything that is a garment must be p= otentially wearable by something" is an example where roda has its int= ended use)
=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0
=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 --gejyspa
=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0

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