Received: from mail-pz0-f61.google.com ([209.85.210.61]:50081) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1R6FDs-0007gT-VJ; Tue, 20 Sep 2011 22:20:01 -0700 Received: by pzk32 with SMTP id 32sf291395pzk.16 for ; Tue, 20 Sep 2011 22:19:47 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:date:from:to:subject:message-id:references :mime-version:content-type:content-disposition:in-reply-to:x-pgp-key :x-pgp-keyid:x-cunselcu'a-valsi:user-agent:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe; bh=uA7+zVAizZ1y+RW05vZPOuXHgE+r8egK+u8pjZ0U9NQ=; b=lpKX3vDo5fTLMcYqUTG07Oyt1AcPYFCBAvJQiPhEny8Q8vAELIymvAldXEGIVgjISt pF3gQHVTNJHc1wGg0At54tYM+09TXICHCQ7O7ABVFJzU5N+fmjXI8qKIlK2UwYmQ54hS 5MwfUrR3EHjYn26GMMleze9DC2rt0fAPAnT8k= Received: by 10.68.209.74 with SMTP id mk10mr70045pbc.73.1316580077880; Tue, 20 Sep 2011 21:41:17 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.68.60.102 with SMTP id g6ls3812176pbr.6.gmail; Tue, 20 Sep 2011 21:41:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.68.25.163 with SMTP id d3mr295099pbg.7.1316580077207; Tue, 20 Sep 2011 21:41:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.68.25.163 with SMTP id d3mr295098pbg.7.1316580077197; Tue, 20 Sep 2011 21:41:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sdf.lonestar.org (mx.sdf.org. [192.94.73.19]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id j4si4840681pbi.2.2011.09.20.21.41.17 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Tue, 20 Sep 2011 21:41:17 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: best guess record for domain of mbays@sdf.org designates 192.94.73.19 as permitted sender) client-ip=192.94.73.19; Received: from gonzales.homelinux.org (root@sverige.freeshell.org [192.94.73.4]) by sdf.lonestar.org (8.14.4/8.14.3) with ESMTP id p8L4fG6u017335 for ; Wed, 21 Sep 2011 04:41:16 GMT Received: from martin by gonzales.homelinux.org with local (Exim 4.75) (envelope-from ) id 1R6EcW-0004Lm-D3 for lojban@googlegroups.com; Wed, 21 Sep 2011 00:41:16 -0400 Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2011 00:41:16 -0400 From: Martin Bays To: lojban@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: [lojban] {zo'e} as close-scope existentially quantified plural variable Message-ID: <20110921044116.GT4310@gonzales> References: <20110918213323.GB6878@gonzales> <20110919013653.GC6878@gonzales> <20110919231314.GI4310@gonzales> <20110920034640.GK4310@gonzales> <20110921011503.GS4310@gonzales> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="0btr6/5+bhBdui6J" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20110921011503.GS4310@gonzales> X-PGP-Key: http://mbays.freeshell.org/pubkey.asc X-PGP-KeyId: B5FB2CD6 X-cunselcu'a-valsi: korbi User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) X-Original-Sender: mbays@sdf.org X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: best guess record for domain of mbays@sdf.org designates 192.94.73.19 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=mbays@sdf.org Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , X-Spam-Score: -0.0 (/) X-Spam_score: -0.0 X-Spam_score_int: 0 X-Spam_bar: / --0btr6/5+bhBdui6J Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable * Tuesday, 2011-09-20 at 21:15 -0400 - Martin Bays : > * Tuesday, 2011-09-20 at 21:16 -0300 - Jorge Llamb=EDas : >=20 > For the third: it could be replaced by {lo remna cu ckaji lo ka se tuple > re da}, or by a tanru - {lo remna cu re mei se tuple} - or by an > explicit generic quantifier, which {so'e} arguably is: {so'e remna cu se > tuple re da}. >=20 > The second is toughest, and a good demonstration of the power of > kind-quantification, but since it is in the end a case of generics, > I think it can be handled similarly: > {so'e xanto cu bramau so'e tumla danlu poi na xanto} Correction: just using {so'e} isn't really adequate for this purpose, of course, because default tense assumptions would have that making a claim only about the present world. Maybe this is where {lo'e} could come in. --0btr6/5+bhBdui6J Content-Type: application/pgp-signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.17 (GNU/Linux) iEYEARECAAYFAk55auwACgkQULC7OLX7LNbS0gCg5NYiRxtxII4uWYJ//wh1GnKT nu8AoNr2NjSdozwzrWfMHSb3/QTOayCc =5wjg -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --0btr6/5+bhBdui6J--