Received: from mail-pz0-f61.google.com ([209.85.210.61]:61271) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1RFBEL-0003SY-GP; Sat, 15 Oct 2011 13:53:24 -0700 Received: by pzk4 with SMTP id 4sf1406317pzk.16 for ; Sat, 15 Oct 2011 13:53:11 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:date:from:to:subject:message-id:references :mime-version:content-type:content-disposition:in-reply-to:x-pgp-key :x-pgp-keyid:x-cunselcu'a-valsi:user-agent:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe; bh=mMr4lqGb1wNyKws0b3yuqHbZvghaK78s0oDfxmNzriI=; b=iQuEkXjUvGbAwOPCtVxWGT0Y1lBNUuHd2ZjIZelsfnpEHq9CR1zV+EF04Dw7qzH3Ny qkrg2BIXFfZqfy/jtJeQQQjP4rhcpCwhxhcXXCjSPmgyMU4FZVHoQ2cq4/6Y8SFcnxtd osFiFyAGDNKDmtkjGe3ebt7mMt90Hat9339jA= Received: by 10.68.71.167 with SMTP id w7mr685046pbu.15.1318711988674; Sat, 15 Oct 2011 13:53:08 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.68.25.98 with SMTP id b2ls8030794pbg.3.gmail; Sat, 15 Oct 2011 13:53:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.68.38.38 with SMTP id d6mr18921614pbk.4.1318711988031; Sat, 15 Oct 2011 13:53:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.68.38.38 with SMTP id d6mr18921612pbk.4.1318711988020; Sat, 15 Oct 2011 13:53:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sdf.lonestar.org (mx.sdf.org. [192.94.73.19]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id r5si13436517pbe.1.2011.10.15.13.53.07 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Sat, 15 Oct 2011 13:53:08 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: best guess record for domain of mbays@sdf.org designates 192.94.73.19 as permitted sender) client-ip=192.94.73.19; Received: from gonzales.homelinux.org (root@sverige.freeshell.org [192.94.73.4]) by sdf.lonestar.org (8.14.5/8.14.3) with ESMTP id p9FKr7Q9023356 for ; Sat, 15 Oct 2011 20:53:07 GMT Received: from martin by gonzales.homelinux.org with local (Exim 4.75) (envelope-from ) id 1RFBEB-0001NP-4I for lojban@googlegroups.com; Sat, 15 Oct 2011 16:53:07 -0400 Date: Sat, 15 Oct 2011 16:53:07 -0400 From: Martin Bays To: lojban@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: [lojban] {zo'e} as close-scope existentially quantified plural variable Message-ID: <20111015205307.GE3779@gonzales> References: <1318202744.44997.YahooMailRC@web81306.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <20111013043308.GD3367@gonzales> <4E981179.1030805@gmail.com> <20111015155009.GA5916@gonzales> <0C7E9636-AC51-48CD-B329-00ECFC4B6604@yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="ey/N+yb7u/X9mFhi" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <0C7E9636-AC51-48CD-B329-00ECFC4B6604@yahoo.com> X-PGP-Key: http://mbays.freeshell.org/pubkey.asc X-PGP-KeyId: B5FB2CD6 X-cunselcu'a-valsi: kenra User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) X-Original-Sender: mbays@sdf.org X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: best guess record for domain of mbays@sdf.org designates 192.94.73.19 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=mbays@sdf.org Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Spam_score: -0.7 X-Spam_score_int: -6 X-Spam_bar: / --ey/N+yb7u/X9mFhi Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline * Saturday, 2011-10-15 at 14:38 -0400 - John E. Clifford : > One problem with Lojban is that quantifier scope need not correspond > to sentences (in some sense of that word -- certainly not bridi). I understand the scope rules to be such that an unbound {da} rises to the first prenex, becoming bound to a quantifier placed there. Prenexes occur in two syntactical constructions: statement, and subsentence. {da broda .i da brode} consists of two statements, so each gets one quantifier. {da broda .i je da brode} is one statement, with one quantifier. Martin --ey/N+yb7u/X9mFhi Content-Type: application/pgp-signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.17 (GNU/Linux) iEYEARECAAYFAk6Z8rMACgkQULC7OLX7LNZ3iACg4cl2XMpOCbJNxF4/yP3p2XfZ g7cAn1ULL9FbJBoXESn76t1n2M6nbixC =7uaN -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --ey/N+yb7u/X9mFhi--