Received: from mail-qw0-f61.google.com ([209.85.216.61]:37844) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1RI4mA-0005tT-RY; Sun, 23 Oct 2011 13:36:17 -0700 Received: by qadb10 with SMTP id b10sf3672590qad.16 for ; Sun, 23 Oct 2011 13:36:04 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:x-authority-analysis:x-cloudmark-score :x-originating-ip:from:to:subject:date:user-agent:references :in-reply-to:mime-version:message-id:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type:content-disposition; bh=z8FgPscDAaEQeXn6giFlXucKJz7A6Is+3N8YGe95abw=; b=rLV4BtfAOJuawo6D6XUokjWolZzXP+6KfLS9wcNm3b3zj53KcqR62+AzmvVeL6ycTI M3wE8FlhRtkUUlL69aJCOXExBVuU6FeUvdjhfz51DfKkuJiIiaN/XhzpyWVDK0V8nerE qCfa2fwe8JeC8y1o2htXe2TnmT4nd6cHypXD8= Received: by 10.224.188.135 with SMTP id da7mr4507623qab.1.1319402161581; Sun, 23 Oct 2011 13:36:01 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.224.182.71 with SMTP id cb7ls11771428qab.4.gmail; Sun, 23 Oct 2011 13:36:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.224.198.6 with SMTP id em6mr15241996qab.0.1319402160951; Sun, 23 Oct 2011 13:36:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.224.198.6 with SMTP id em6mr15241995qab.0.1319402160943; Sun, 23 Oct 2011 13:36:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cdptpa-omtalb.mail.rr.com (cdptpa-omtalb.mail.rr.com. [75.180.132.123]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id s41si10496432qcq.3.2011.10.23.13.36.00; Sun, 23 Oct 2011 13:36:00 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: neutral (google.com: 75.180.132.123 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of phma@phma.optus.nu) client-ip=75.180.132.123; X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.1 cv=gqMFsD3PqRa+9IMRRYznR/JjFzasGotwKYCDC6iWcAk= c=1 sm=0 a=6ti_TD8eFm8A:10 a=imlZSETpPW0A:10 a=wPDyFdB5xvgA:10 a=Q9fys5e9bTEA:10 a=9o99xeNKNPYSmM5t9x5+TQ==:17 a=ujfHDVoMRLcNhrjimdcA:9 a=PUjeQqilurYA:10 a=9o99xeNKNPYSmM5t9x5+TQ==:117 X-Cloudmark-Score: 0 X-Originating-IP: 75.176.118.168 Received: from [75.176.118.168] ([75.176.118.168:60443] helo=chausie) by cdptpa-oedge03.mail.rr.com (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.3.46 r()) with ESMTP id 8D/CC-02308-FAA74AE4; Sun, 23 Oct 2011 20:36:00 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by chausie (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0F7D31792E for ; Sun, 23 Oct 2011 16:35:57 -0400 (EDT) From: Pierre Abbat To: lojban@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: [lojban] Re: lojban and PR Date: Sun, 23 Oct 2011 16:35:49 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.6 (enterprise 0.20070907.709405) References: <4ae1bfdf-61ba-4539-84e0-0a56a67480fd@u13g2000vbx.googlegroups.com> <17558590.1835.1319383267925.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@yqbl36> In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <201110231635.52021.phma@phma.optus.nu> X-Original-Sender: phma@phma.optus.nu X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=neutral (google.com: 75.180.132.123 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of phma@phma.optus.nu) smtp.mail=phma@phma.optus.nu Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline X-Spam-Score: -0.0 (/) X-Spam_score: -0.0 X-Spam_score_int: 0 X-Spam_bar: / On Sunday 23 October 2011 13:11:31 .arpis. wrote: > The language is not finalized yet (as evidenced by the {ji'i} 200 > discussion about {zo'e}). Most of that discussion is incomprehensible to me, and probably to most Lojbanists. > The language is not self-hosting (many definitions of words, especially > gismu, rely on another language, often English, to be understood) A language can never be exactly defined in terms of itself, so that's generally not a problem. I have no problem with "rozgu" or "djacu" or "lanme". I do have a problem with "jbari", as it's defined in terms of English "berry", which is polysemous. One definition includes strawberries and raspberries and blueberries but excludes tomatoes and oranges; the other does the reverse. Pierre -- .i toljundi do .ibabo mi'afra tu'a do .ibabo damba do .ibabo do jinga .icu'u la ma'atman. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en.