Received: from mail-gx0-f189.google.com ([209.85.161.189]:54671) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1RN1oH-0007Vk-Kq; Sun, 06 Nov 2011 04:27:01 -0800 Received: by ggnr4 with SMTP id r4sf5367957ggn.16 for ; Sun, 06 Nov 2011 04:26:43 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:date:from:to:subject:message-id :mail-followup-to:references:mime-version:in-reply-to:user-agent :sender:x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post :list-help:list-archive:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type :content-disposition; bh=X9OH+UtEycYi6lDLBi9vv4i09MOO9+RrX0UBJI9hHJU=; b=FsizJ5Nuv2ELy+WOShmDUoTHj5mXGR09CsCieUlhh4OLu29EPdrynegNJnkIVSIZvj 0ID6VRg9O7aAz0NDwMhzGj4cXwDL0dyZR/YfZ+zkGUkg1oKEzX/YmW3gvBIQdq5mLgm4 lem/ZP9RC9SomozNvY/MTZozZ3YUoAX9BqYD8= Received: by 10.236.22.225 with SMTP id t61mr6176083yht.16.1320582380542; Sun, 06 Nov 2011 04:26:20 -0800 (PST) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.101.206.2 with SMTP id i2ls10281283anq.1.gmail; Sun, 06 Nov 2011 04:26:18 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.101.198.2 with SMTP id a2mr5204024anq.50.1320582378946; Sun, 06 Nov 2011 04:26:18 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.101.198.2 with SMTP id a2mr5204023anq.50.1320582378923; Sun, 06 Nov 2011 04:26:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from stodi.digitalkingdom.org (mail.digitalkingdom.org. [173.13.139.236]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id l3si12411228pbd.0.2011.11.06.04.26.18 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Sun, 06 Nov 2011 04:26:18 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of rlpowell@stodi.digitalkingdom.org designates 173.13.139.236 as permitted sender) client-ip=173.13.139.236; Received: from rlpowell by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1RN1nl-0007VZ-Bv for lojban@googlegroups.com; Sun, 06 Nov 2011 04:26:17 -0800 Date: Sun, 6 Nov 2011 04:26:17 -0800 From: Robin Lee Powell To: lojban@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: [lojban] baby words: "help" Message-ID: <20111106122616.GG21434@stodi.digitalkingdom.org> Mail-Followup-To: lojban@googlegroups.com References: <20111106054303.GT8607@stodi.digitalkingdom.org> <20111106104913.GL15498@nvg.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <20111106104913.GL15498@nvg.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: rlpowell@digitalkingdom.org X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of rlpowell@stodi.digitalkingdom.org designates 173.13.139.236 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=rlpowell@stodi.digitalkingdom.org Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline X-Spam-Score: -0.0 (/) X-Spam_score: -0.0 X-Spam_score_int: 0 X-Spam_bar: / On Sun, Nov 06, 2011 at 11:49:13AM +0100, Arnt Richard Johansen wrote: > On Sat, Nov 05, 2011 at 10:43:04PM -0700, Robin Lee Powell wrote: > > > > "Sleeping helps you grow strong". I'm sure there's an obvious > > gismu here, but I'm missing it. > > I checked the definition of {sidju}: > > x1 helps/assists/aids object/person x2 do/achieve/maintain > event/activity x3. > > I've been assuming that x1 needs to be a person, but having an > event in the x1 seems to be perfectly fine. I hate place types so very much. Some day I want to spend some time thinking about a system for dropping them. :P I've added a note to http://www.lojban.org/tiki/BPFK+Section%3A+gismu+Issues , since I happen to have it up anyway. > Another possibility might be {to'e zunti} but maybe that goes > beyond kiddie talk: > > x1 (evt./state) interferes with/hinders/disrupts x2 > (evt./state/process) due to quality x3 (ka). Interesting. So that's like "supports" in the way that {sarji} isn't. :) -Robin -- http://singinst.org/ : Our last, best hope for a fantastic future. Lojban (http://www.lojban.org/): The language in which "this parrot is dead" is "ti poi spitaki cu morsi", but "this sentence is false" is "na nei". My personal page: http://www.digitalkingdom.org/rlp/ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en.