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Date: Sun, 6 Nov 2011 17:11:57 -0500
From: Martin Bays <mbays@sdf.org>
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Subject: Re: [lojban] {zo'e} as close-scope existentially quantified plural variable
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* Sunday, 2011-11-06 at 18:58 -0300 - Jorge Llamb=EDas <jjllambias@gmail.co=
m>:

> On Sun, Nov 6, 2011 at 6:11 PM, Martin Bays <mbays@sdf.org> wrote:
> > * Sunday, 2011-11-06 at 17:15 -0300 - Jorge Llamb=EDas <jjllambias@gmai=
l.com>:
> >> And even so, mere set disjointness doesn't seem to get at the heart of
> >> the matter, which is probably in the x3 of klesi:
> >>
> >> "lo ranmapku jo'u lo bolmapku cu ficysi'u lo ka ce'u klesi lo mapku ma=
 kau"
> >
> > Yes, good. So I'd want to add three characters:
> > {lo ranmaplei jo'u lo bolmaplei cu ficysi'u lo ka ce'u klesi lo maplei =
ma kau}
>=20
> You could extend that method to all predicates. So instead of:
>=20
>   lo prenu cu klama lo zarci lo zdani lo dargu lo karce
>=20
> you can say:
>=20
>   lo prekla cu klama lo zacyselkla lo zdaterkla lo dagvelkla lo karcyxelk=
la

Are you mocking me? zo'o

There's no problem with prenu klamaing; there is a problem with ranmapku
klesiing.

> >> >> Why is beret - hat - garment artificial?
> >> > But they're all on the same level, no?
> >> As kinds? A beret is a kind of hat, and a hat is a kind of garment.
> >
> > I'm only seeing two levels there - one containing berets and hats, and
> > one containing kinds of hat and kinds of garment.
>=20
> One level contains the garment, next level down the hat, next level
> down the beret (and a fourth level I hadn't mentioned because it won't
> enter into a klesi relationship contains some particular individual
> beret.) So "klesi" relates two things from different levels.

Oh, no, we're not using the same definition of 'level'.

I was reserving that for the problematic case, where going up a level
corresponding to passing from AE to EA. I believe this corresponds to
(your version of) {mupli}.

I meant to ask for a natural example where we go up two mupli-levels
=66rom mundanes.

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