Received: from mail-pz0-f61.google.com ([209.85.210.61]:64082) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1RW97J-00060H-6k; Thu, 01 Dec 2011 08:04:17 -0800 Received: by dajx4 with SMTP id x4sf303445daj.16 for ; Thu, 01 Dec 2011 08:04:03 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:date:from:to:subject:message-id :mail-followup-to:references:mime-version:in-reply-to:user-agent :sender:x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post :list-help:list-archive:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type :content-disposition; bh=nPL9FlU9a+ffXNalwR31/3MBbmUF6PslrJtKe1SkPSE=; b=KYsW/kZCGeUj2ItueDRsh6aSuGn3+ETzpWvi/vNbbTUYb5uOCgoe/jqpbXaxjQY7P7 DZsNCeImY17R5r5IKVKimxR6NiuUOC8yKSiNn1MNsvPf8p7KOEjujeY97lo5OpyUKWT2 iKLC//x2WX5fdTjy2/3wVvpngb18TMD0ssQSU= Received: by 10.68.31.136 with SMTP id a8mr356363pbi.9.1322755440977; Thu, 01 Dec 2011 08:04:00 -0800 (PST) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.68.11.197 with SMTP id s5ls11267486pbb.0.gmail; Thu, 01 Dec 2011 08:04:00 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.68.11.9 with SMTP id m9mr3687416pbb.1.1322755440430; Thu, 01 Dec 2011 08:04:00 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.68.11.9 with SMTP id m9mr3687413pbb.1.1322755440419; Thu, 01 Dec 2011 08:04:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from stodi.digitalkingdom.org (mail.digitalkingdom.org. [173.13.139.236]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id u7si7904169pbn.2.2011.12.01.08.04.00 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Thu, 01 Dec 2011 08:04:00 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of rlpowell@stodi.digitalkingdom.org designates 173.13.139.236 as permitted sender) client-ip=173.13.139.236; Received: from rlpowell by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1RW979-00060D-Ga for lojban@googlegroups.com; Thu, 01 Dec 2011 08:03:59 -0800 Date: Thu, 1 Dec 2011 08:03:59 -0800 From: Robin Lee Powell To: lojban@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: [lojban] Rant (baby related): dasni, taxfu, and all their friends. Message-ID: <20111201160359.GE22210@stodi.digitalkingdom.org> Mail-Followup-To: lojban@googlegroups.com References: <20111130173647.GO8581@stodi.digitalkingdom.org> <20111130195612.GF2886@gonzales> <20111201041638.GZ8581@stodi.digitalkingdom.org> <20111201153201.GN2886@gonzales> MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <20111201153201.GN2886@gonzales> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: rlpowell@digitalkingdom.org X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of rlpowell@stodi.digitalkingdom.org designates 173.13.139.236 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=rlpowell@stodi.digitalkingdom.org Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline X-Spam-Score: -0.0 (/) X-Spam_score: -0.0 X-Spam_score_int: 0 X-Spam_bar: / On Thu, Dec 01, 2011 at 10:32:01AM -0500, Martin Bays wrote: > * Wednesday, 2011-11-30 at 20:16 -0800 - Robin Lee Powell > : > > > On Wed, Nov 30, 2011 at 02:56:12PM -0500, Martin Bays wrote: > > > * Wednesday, 2011-11-30 at 09:36 -0800 - Robin Lee Powell > > > : > > > > > > > This means the *only* way to talk about people wearing > > > > clothing is with {dasni}. > > > > > > > > WTF is the point of having place structures if I can't say > > > > {mi te pastu}? > > > > > > Because then something would pastu only when it was being > > > worn. > > > > And botpi must contain something, as must kabri. > > The difference is that always do contain something, even if only > air or empty space, but being worn isn't intrinsic to the physical > form of a pastu. That wanders into gluteality (i.e. being an ass); if someone says {ti botpi} and I say {ti botpi ma}, and they say {ti botpi [how the hell do you say "vacuum"?]} or {ti botpi lo canlu}, I'm going to be pretty annoyed. OTOH, botpi says "container *for* x2", so who the hell knows what *that* means? :P kabri doesn't have that problem, though. > (There's also the question of whether the x2 of botpi ("for x2") > is actually meant to imply vasru, or whether it should be taken to > be analagous to taxfu's x2) Oh, you noticed that too. Yeah, I can't tell. There's already a sort-of comment about this on the gismu issues page, but I've updated it a bit. > > I'm not seeing the problem. > > I suppose that depends on whether you're willing e.g. to accept > {lo ka'e broda} as a likely interpretation of {lo broda}? If it was up to me, I'd define certain places as being ka'e-able: that is, "this place is normally filled by X [where in the case of botpi X would be "what the bottle currently contains"], but even if there is no current or obvious X, the capability is sufficient for the semantics of this word; zi'o should only be used if the capability has been lost". -Robin -- http://singinst.org/ : Our last, best hope for a fantastic future. Lojban (http://www.lojban.org/): The language in which "this parrot is dead" is "ti poi spitaki cu morsi", but "this sentence is false" is "na nei". My personal page: http://www.digitalkingdom.org/rlp/ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en.