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[192.94.73.19]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id n6si8235861pbg.2.2011.12.08.17.42.57 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Thu, 08 Dec 2011 17:42:57 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: best guess record for domain of mbays@sdf.org designates 192.94.73.19 as permitted sender) client-ip=192.94.73.19; Received: from gonzales.homelinux.org (root@sverige.freeshell.org [192.94.73.4]) by sdf.lonestar.org (8.14.5/8.14.3) with ESMTP id pB91guIm027098 for ; Fri, 9 Dec 2011 01:42:56 GMT Received: from martin by gonzales.homelinux.org with local (Exim 4.75) (envelope-from ) id 1RYpUG-0001ZU-Cr for lojban@googlegroups.com; Thu, 08 Dec 2011 20:42:56 -0500 Date: Thu, 8 Dec 2011 20:42:56 -0500 From: Martin Bays To: lojban@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: [lojban] semantic parser - tersmu-0.1rc1 Message-ID: <20111209014256.GC12304@gonzales> References: <20111204014942.GC11790@gonzales> <20111204172803.GA3091@gonzales> <1323097700.59133.YahooMailRC@web81308.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <1323271781.23349.YahooMailRC@web81306.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <611800B1-334B-4D32-B782-6ED30F1E8E62@yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="oJ71EGRlYNjSvfq7" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-PGP-Key: http://mbays.freeshell.org/pubkey.asc X-PGP-KeyId: B5FB2CD6 X-cunselcu'a-valsi: rokci User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) X-Original-Sender: mbays@sdf.org X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: best guess record for domain of mbays@sdf.org designates 192.94.73.19 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=mbays@sdf.org Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Spam_score: -0.7 X-Spam_score_int: -6 X-Spam_bar: / --oJ71EGRlYNjSvfq7 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable * Thursday, 2011-12-08 at 13:48 -0300 - Jorge Llamb=EDas : > A somewhat separate issue is what to do with apparently unbound > variables. The basic rule is: >=20 > (4) Ex:P(x) <---> P(x) >=20 > but again this is underspecified as to the order in which it has to be > applied with respect to the other rules. If you want to unpack > P(Ax,y), you get something different if you apply (1) and then (4), or > if you apply (4) first and then (1). >=20 > My preferred rule is that whenever you run into a variable x which is > apparently unbound, it gets replaced by Ex, so P(x) must be read as > P(Ex) and only then apply the unpacking rules 1, 2 and 3 in the order > described above. But even better is to never omit the explicit > quantifier. If you'll excuse me tangling this thread... It occurs to me that this indicates a simple description of the difference between the two possible rules we were discussing for handling bare {da} after a da-binding connective. They both have us, as you say, replacing x by Ex whenever we run into an apparently unbound x - the difference is just in when they run into it. In the case of {ro da .e ko'a da}: under one rule (I) the connective causes us to *fork*, and process the remainder of the sentence in two different parallel contexts, so the bare {da} is run into *twice*. For the other (II), I see two ways to imagine (and code) it: either (a) we have a preprocessing stage which statically observes that the bare {da} isn't going to be properly bound so adds a {su'o} to it, and then we process as above; or (b) we have no such preprocessing stage, but nor do we really fork in the sense above - rather, once the connective is complete subsequent terms are seen but once, and are applied to both arms of the connective. (Please note that in both cases, I am assuming that all referring constant terms do their referring prior to this algorithm; the forking doesn't involve textual reduplication) I do still find (I) the most conceptually intuitive, although the results of (II) may be cleaner. Martin --oJ71EGRlYNjSvfq7 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.17 (GNU/Linux) iEYEARECAAYFAk7hZ6AACgkQULC7OLX7LNZhJwCfR8ueiLJsorcIcAFkaEOUdMMj SSsAoNgVpERxLmq3EYBHRDOQI88jmvNQ =8RtO -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --oJ71EGRlYNjSvfq7--