Received: from mail-vw0-f61.google.com ([209.85.212.61]:60388) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1RbN2w-00059T-93; Thu, 15 Dec 2011 17:57:22 -0800 Received: by vbbfs19 with SMTP id fs19sf1041632vbb.16 for ; Thu, 15 Dec 2011 17:57:07 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=i2+Sm9X5vooMfwPt/jdMoO+eOpc1qbYqnrEZBlQ5s+Q=; b=AhoOj29PEGLG1reXLUNYxkmt7dOD6TAs7BJx9rrYPksjLCwhe3/N01Mr30i9FLAn+Q BD3klny3Dzz/CRdZddrcOvSLhTDYFj19Ue6bPPMvpqcWt88uPrZSojnDkjwRV8oM384t PER5UVnuFNWYqGHW0LwbpPFmQwqo56bmj0k6w= Received: by 10.52.76.8 with SMTP id g8mr378255vdw.16.1324000623698; Thu, 15 Dec 2011 17:57:03 -0800 (PST) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.220.108.71 with SMTP id e7ls811490vcp.3.canary; Thu, 15 Dec 2011 17:57:02 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.52.29.227 with SMTP id n3mr4320425vdh.7.1324000622766; Thu, 15 Dec 2011 17:57:02 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.52.29.227 with SMTP id n3mr4320423vdh.7.1324000622746; Thu, 15 Dec 2011 17:57:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-vw0-f45.google.com (mail-vw0-f45.google.com [209.85.212.45]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id ij1si2386155vdb.3.2011.12.15.17.57.02 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Thu, 15 Dec 2011 17:57:02 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of nictytan@gmail.com designates 209.85.212.45 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.212.45; Received: by mail-vw0-f45.google.com with SMTP id u11so2179772vbb.4 for ; Thu, 15 Dec 2011 17:57:02 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.52.89.71 with SMTP id bm7mr4927524vdb.41.1324000622575; Thu, 15 Dec 2011 17:57:02 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.52.69.19 with HTTP; Thu, 15 Dec 2011 17:57:02 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: <20111214183256.GG21878@stodi.digitalkingdom.org> <20111214224426.GR21878@stodi.digitalkingdom.org> <20111215195633.GZ21878@stodi.digitalkingdom.org> Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2011 20:57:02 -0500 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] Baby words: "I accept" as a selbri? From: tsani nicte To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: nictytan@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of nictytan@gmail.com designates 209.85.212.45 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=nictytan@gmail.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=20cf307d02b4ca810804b42beabd X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Spam_score: -0.7 X-Spam_score_int: -6 X-Spam_bar: / --20cf307d02b4ca810804b42beabd Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable It seems like it might depend on whether one considers a will to do something a desire to do that thing. Robin, I might translate what you want as [i mi djica lo nu bevri do .ijeku'i mi ba'o kakne lo nu cadzu] (or with attitudinals, which seem more natural in conversation, as [i au bevri do .ijeku'i e'enai cadzu]) mu'o mi'e la tan On Thu, Dec 15, 2011 at 3:23 PM, Jonathan Jones wrote: > From http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/willing > Adjective > > *willing* (*comparative > * *more willing*, *superlative > * *most willing*) > > 1. Ready to do something that is > not (can't be expected as) a ma= tter > of course . *If my > boyfriend isn't willing to change his drinking habits, I will split up > with him.* > > There's also a noun and verb definition, but they don't seem to be > applicable to this. > > > On Thu, Dec 15, 2011 at 12:56 PM, Robin Lee Powell < > rlpowell@digitalkingdom.org> wrote: > >> On Thu, Dec 15, 2011 at 02:38:14PM -0500, Michael Turniansky wrote: >> > On Wed, Dec 14, 2011 at 5:44 PM, Robin Lee Powell < >> > rlpowell@digitalkingdom.org> wrote: >> > >> > > On Wed, Dec 14, 2011 at 07:41:16PM -0300, Jorge Llamb=EDas wrote: >> > > > On Wed, Dec 14, 2011 at 3:32 PM, Robin Lee Powell >> > > > wrote: >> > > > > >> > > > > The original was something like "I'm willing to carry you all >> > > > > the time, I just can't walk any more". I got stuck on the first >> > > > > clause. >> > > > >> > > > To be willing to do something you just can't do doesn't seem to >> > > > take much commitment, does it? >> > > >> > > I was afraid that confusion would occur. I was still willing to >> > > *hold* them, and even hold them standing up, but not to continue >> > > walking (they wouldn't stop crying unless I was actually walking). >> > > So those are two disparate clauses; pamjai and cadzu. >> > > >> > > > For "amenable" I use "bredi", but I'm not sure it works when you >> > > > are unable to do it. >> > > >> > > Hmmm. Yeah, {bredi} is pretty good, thanks. >> > > >> > >> > I'm not so sure about "bredi". There is a reason the expression >> > is "ready, willing, and able" -- They imply three different >> > states. I should think "willing" might be more in the domain of >> > sarxe/tugni/mapti. I.e, my internal state is in accord with yours, >> > whether or not I am actually able or prepared to do so. >> >> I don't really like any of them, honestly. -_- Mostly including >> {bredi}. >> >> So, time for a new word? What does "willing" actually *mean*? >> >> -Robin >> >> -- >> http://singinst.org/ : Our last, best hope for a fantastic future. >> Lojban (http://www.lojban.org/): The language in which "this parrot >> is dead" is "ti poi spitaki cu morsi", but "this sentence is false" >> is "na nei". My personal page: http://www.digitalkingdom.org/rlp/ >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Group= s >> "lojban" group. >> To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=3Den. >> >> > > > -- > mu'o mi'e .aionys. > > .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o > (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D ) > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "lojban" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=3Den. > --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den. --20cf307d02b4ca810804b42beabd Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable It seems like it might depend on whether one considers a will to do somethi= ng a desire to do that thing.
Robin, I might translate what you want as= [i mi djica lo nu bevri do .ijeku'i mi ba'o kakne lo nu cadzu]
(or with attitudinals, which seem more natural in conversation, as [i = au bevri do .ijeku'i e'enai cadzu])

mu'= ;o mi'e la tan

On Thu, Dec 15, 2011 a= t 3:23 PM, Jonathan Jones <eyeonus@gmail.com> wrote:

From http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/willing

Adjective

willing (comparative more willing, superlative most willing)

  1. Ready to do something that is not (can'= ;t be expected as) a matter of co= urse.
    If my boyfriend isn't willing to change = his drinking habits, I will split up with him.
There's also a noun and verb definition, but they don't s= eem to be applicable to this.

On Thu, Dec 15, 2011 at 12:56 PM, Robin Lee Po= well <rlpowell@digitalkingdom.org> wrote:
On Thu, Dec 15, 2011 at 02:38:14PM -050= 0, Michael Turniansky wrote:
> On Wed, Dec 14, 2011 at 5:44 PM, Robin Lee Powell <
> rlpow= ell@digitalkingdom.org> wrote:
>
> > On Wed, Dec 14, 2011 at 07:41:16PM -0300, Jorge Llamb=EDas wrote:=
> > > On Wed, Dec 14, 2011 at 3:32 PM, Robin Lee Powell
> > > <rlpowell@digitalkingdom.org> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > The original was something like "I'm willing t= o carry you all
> > > > the time, I just can't walk any more". =A0I go= t stuck on the first
> > > > clause.
> > >
> > > To be willing to do something you just can't do doesn= 9;t seem to
> > > take much commitment, does it?
> >
> > I was afraid that confusion would occur. =A0I was still willing t= o
> > *hold* them, and even hold them standing up, but not to continue<= br> > > walking (they wouldn't stop crying unless I was actually walk= ing).
> > So those are two disparate clauses; pamjai and cadzu.
> >
> > > For "amenable" I use "bredi", but I'= m not sure it works when you
> > > are unable to do it.
> >
> > Hmmm. =A0Yeah, {bredi} is pretty good, thanks.
> >
>
> I'm not so sure about "bredi". =A0There is a reason the = expression
> is "ready, willing, and able" -- They imply three different<= br> > states. =A0I should think "willing" might be more in the dom= ain of
> sarxe/tugni/mapti. I.e, my internal state is in accord with yours,
> whether or not I am actually able or prepared to do so.

I don't really like any of them, honestly. =A0-_- =A0Mostly inclu= ding
{bredi}.

So, time for a new word? =A0What does "willing" actually *mean*?<= br>

-Robin

--
http://singinst.org/= : =A0Our last, best hope for a fantastic future.
Lojban (http://www.loj= ban.org/): The language in which "this parrot
is dead" is "ti poi spitaki cu morsi", but "this senten= ce is false"
is "na nei". =A0 My personal page: http://www.digitalkingdom.org/rlp/
--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups &= quot;lojban" group.
To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojba= n?hl=3Den.




--
mu'o mi'e .aionys.<= br>
.i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do = zo'o
(Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )


--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups &= quot;lojban" group.
To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojba= n?hl=3Den.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group.
To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den.
--20cf307d02b4ca810804b42beabd--