Received: from mail-bk0-f61.google.com ([209.85.214.61]:61977) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1RwffH-0007eA-29; Sun, 12 Feb 2012 12:05:01 -0800 Received: by bkty15 with SMTP id y15sf6024280bkt.16 for ; Sun, 12 Feb 2012 12:04:42 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=PyoBJ6x8PKdpKRe5q96M9Lk9Hurja+viqGTXBDY3YS4=; b=u8yfiTEsA/JIFs5E30yGgXg3FxC3qDwXWyLMYCgZTrZa54K/LaN9Eb9ixC4fvnXtKA eUYs3ByicCGbRXwRafkl7088r9GkcnaJB6wellzbBDUNJpOgMkF5zVoFLWNK2qkW2Dz5 /yyvYFM5TIlmdT3VreBtJoveK8jS20F6KbsCc= Received: by 10.204.148.86 with SMTP id o22mr760881bkv.24.1329077080230; Sun, 12 Feb 2012 12:04:40 -0800 (PST) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.204.17.69 with SMTP id r5ls583550bka.2.gmail; Sun, 12 Feb 2012 12:04:38 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.205.129.137 with SMTP id hi9mr1163377bkc.8.1329077078521; Sun, 12 Feb 2012 12:04:38 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.205.129.137 with SMTP id hi9mr1163376bkc.8.1329077078497; Sun, 12 Feb 2012 12:04:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-lpp01m020-f182.google.com (mail-lpp01m020-f182.google.com [209.85.217.182]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id b3si19721191bka.0.2012.02.12.12.04.38 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Sun, 12 Feb 2012 12:04:38 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of eyeonus@gmail.com designates 209.85.217.182 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.217.182; Received: by lbbgj3 with SMTP id gj3so3841485lbb.27 for ; Sun, 12 Feb 2012 12:04:38 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.112.86.67 with SMTP id n3mr4684878lbz.29.1329077078118; Sun, 12 Feb 2012 12:04:38 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.152.148.225 with HTTP; Sun, 12 Feb 2012 12:04:38 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: <201202120811.10298.phma@phma.optus.nu> <201202121212.05119.phma@phma.optus.nu> Date: Sun, 12 Feb 2012 13:04:38 -0700 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] vowel and stress From: Jonathan Jones To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: eyeonus@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of eyeonus@gmail.com designates 209.85.217.182 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=eyeonus@gmail.com; dkim=pass header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=bcaec554e1141ed12004b8c9dfc8 X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Spam_score: -0.7 X-Spam_score_int: -6 X-Spam_bar: / --bcaec554e1141ed12004b8c9dfc8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sun, Feb 12, 2012 at 11:44 AM, Remo Dentato wrote: > On Sun, Feb 12, 2012 at 6:23 PM, Jonathan Jones wrote= : > > How do you type an accented character on a U.S. keyboard? We don't have= a > > compose key, unless we're running Linux and set, say, caps-lock to it..= .. > > Using Left Alt + code (on numeric pad) should work (it does on my > WIndows 7 box) > > 133 =E0 > 138 =E8 > 141 =EC > 149 =F2 > 151 =F9 > > I used this long time ago, when the Italian keyboards didn't have the > characters "{`}" and I was programming in C (btw, the Italian keyboard > doesn't have the bactick still Alt+96). > > Should everything else fail, the charmap.exe utility (in the > Accessories folder) will let you copy the accented characters in the > clipboard (and you'll have to paste them where you need them). > Oh, I know about the charmap and the alt thing. However, their is a lot more effort involved in both those methods then merely using Capital letters, and in general humans are very lazy. O requires two keystrokes. = =F2 requires at least 4 using the ALT+n method as well as requiring one to memorize it's number, and charmap is so inefficient it's not worth talking about. Using a compose key is really the only way that's viable competition to using capitals: ,o,` is only one more keystroke than +o, and doesn't require much more in the way of memorization. > Considering how infrequently accented characters are used in Lojban, I > would consider this a little hindrance compared to having to throw > capital letters in the middle of a lojban word. > > remod Personally, I'm not really concerned with punctuation marking method. I'll agree that using accents are more appealing visually, but I'm in agreement with .xorxes. in that the pronunciation of a word does not change the word-- .*ai*onys., .a*io*nys., .*aio*nys., etc. are all the same word: my name. (Apologies to those which have a mail client that interprets underlining by displaying it as ._ai_onys.) --=20 mu'o mi'e .aionys. .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D ) --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den. --bcaec554e1141ed12004b8c9dfc8 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On Sun, Feb 12, 2012 at 11:44 AM, Remo Dentato <= span dir=3D"ltr"><rdentato@gmail.c= om> wrote:
On Sun, Feb 12, 2012 at 6:23 PM, Jonathan Jones <eyeonus@gmail.com> wrote:
> How do you type an accented character on a U.S. keyboard? We don't= have a
> compose key, unless we're running Linux and set, say, caps-lock to= it....

Using =A0 Left Alt =A0+ code (on numeric pad) =A0should work (it does= on my
WIndows 7 box)

133 =A0 =A0 =E0
138 =A0 =A0 =E8
141 =A0 =A0 =EC
149 =A0 =A0 =F2
151 =A0 =A0 =F9

I used this long time ago, when the Italian keyboards didn't have the characters "{`}" and I was programming in C (btw, the Italian key= board
doesn't have the bactick still Alt+96).

Should everything else fail, the charmap.exe utility (in the
Accessories folder) will let you copy the accented characters in the
clipboard (and you'll have to paste them where you need them).

Oh, I know about the charmap and the alt thing. However, t= heir is a lot=20 more effort involved in both those methods then merely using Capital=20 letters, and in general humans are very lazy. O requires two keystrokes. =F2 requires at least 4 using the ALT+n method as well as requiring one=20 to memorize it's number, and charmap is so inefficient it's not wor= th=20 talking about. Using a compose key is really the only way that's viable= =20 competition to using capitals: <compose>,o,` is only one more=20 keystroke than <shift>+o, and doesn't require much more in the wa= y of memorization.
=A0
Considering how infrequently accented characters are used in Lojban, I
would consider this a little hindrance compared to having to throw
capital letters in the middle of a lojban word.

remod

Personally, I'm not really concerned with p= unctuation marking method. I'll agree that using accents are more appea= ling visually, but I'm in agreement with .xorxes. in that the pronuncia= tion of a word does not change the word-- .aionys., .aionys.,= .aionys., etc. are all the same word: my name. (Apologies to those = which have a mail client that interprets underlining by displaying it as ._= ai_onys.)

--
mu'o mi'e .aionys.

.i.e'ucai ko cmima lo piln= o be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o
(Come to the Dot Side! Lu= ke, I am your father. :D )

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group.
To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den.
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