Received: from mail-bk0-f61.google.com ([209.85.214.61]:43887) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1Ryls5-0004Ar-5R; Sat, 18 Feb 2012 07:06:51 -0800 Received: by bkty15 with SMTP id y15sf4848312bkt.16 for ; Sat, 18 Feb 2012 07:06:37 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to :references:date:message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=KiNiMSloiMrsHhKRSqdxDyUb71bGcL081jHkybrH4OI=; b=Gh7IjTSWRyuHy1xo/xT4nQMtsDpMlGUt7+oShWC0ip7pMz7JbitBkEUiT6bQlRFcUH b1ZDA7jK2AUDXcpmEtGNW2kLFjyr/OsMmGt0XO6G295v9gtOXmIeXyEkzlilIiH4cSuA Pw/GvvIerJMmRaYnGttJM5ofqiuAOBt3uETx4= Received: by 10.205.124.12 with SMTP id gm12mr998582bkc.35.1329577595373; Sat, 18 Feb 2012 07:06:35 -0800 (PST) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.205.113.145 with SMTP id ew17ls6259892bkc.8.gmail; Sat, 18 Feb 2012 07:06:33 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.204.154.143 with SMTP id o15mr1000243bkw.4.1329577593704; Sat, 18 Feb 2012 07:06:33 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.204.154.143 with SMTP id o15mr1000242bkw.4.1329577593692; Sat, 18 Feb 2012 07:06:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-lpp01m010-f54.google.com (mail-lpp01m010-f54.google.com [209.85.215.54]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id l17si16361684bkb.1.2012.02.18.07.06.33 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Sat, 18 Feb 2012 07:06:33 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of jjllambias@gmail.com designates 209.85.215.54 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.215.54; Received: by lagz14 with SMTP id z14so8520604lag.27 for ; Sat, 18 Feb 2012 07:06:33 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of jjllambias@gmail.com designates 10.152.130.167 as permitted sender) client-ip=10.152.130.167; Received: from mr.google.com ([10.152.130.167]) by 10.152.130.167 with SMTP id of7mr9576295lab.36.1329577593398 (num_hops = 1); Sat, 18 Feb 2012 07:06:33 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.152.130.167 with SMTP id of7mr7983086lab.36.1329577593355; Sat, 18 Feb 2012 07:06:33 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.112.110.105 with HTTP; Sat, 18 Feb 2012 07:06:33 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <201202180002.25250.phma@phma.optus.nu> References: <201202180002.25250.phma@phma.optus.nu> Date: Sat, 18 Feb 2012 12:06:33 -0300 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] masknonji From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jorge_Llamb=EDas?= To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: jjllambias@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of jjllambias@gmail.com designates 209.85.215.54 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=jjllambias@gmail.com; dkim=pass header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Spam_score: -0.7 X-Spam_score_int: -6 X-Spam_bar: / On Sat, Feb 18, 2012 at 2:02 AM, Pierre Abbat wrote: > By my rules and by vlatai > it is, but I'm not sure about xorxes's rules, because the "n" could be > syllabic. Here's a recap on my views on Lojban syllables: There are 64 valid consonantal syllables: bl cl dl fl gl jl kl ml nl pl rl sl tl vl xl zl bm cm dm fm gm jm km lm nm pm rm sm tm vm xm zm bn cn dn fn gn jn kn ln mn pn rn sn tn vn xn zn br cr dr fr gr jr kr lr mr nr pr sr tr vr xr zr There are (2 + 36 + 4 + 97) x 10 x 18 = 25020 valid vocalic syllables. Each vocalic syllable consists of onset + nucleus + coda. There are 18 codas: b, c, d, f, g, j, k, l, m, n, p, r, s, t v, x, z and empty. There are 10 nuclei: a, e, i, o, u, ai, au, ei, oi, y There are 139 onsets, which we can divide into 4 groups: 2 special onsets: . and ' (These are special in that . can only occur at the beginning of a word, and ' can only occur in the middle of a word, so in a sense they are complementary and could eventually be considered the same onset expressed differently in different contexts.) 36 approximant onsets: i, bi, ci, di, fi, gi, ji, ki, li, mi, ni, pi, ri, si, ti, vi, xi, zi u, bu, cu, du, fu, ju, ku, lu, mu, nu, pu, ru, su, tu, vu, xu, zu 4 affricate onsets: dj, dz, tc, ts 97 ordinary onsets, consisting of 1, 2 or 3 consonants each taken in order from the following groups: [c, j, s, z] [b, d, f, g, k, m, n, p, t, v, x] [l, r] with the following constraints: - a voiced consonant from the first group cannot be followed by an unvoiced one from the second, and viceversa. - s, c cannot be followed by x - j, z cannot be followed by n or l - d, t cannot be followed by l - n cannot be followed by l, r So in all I have 25020 vocalic + 64 consonantal = 25084 valid syllables. This number increases considerably if we allow double-consonant codas. mu'o mi'e xorxes -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en.