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[69.132.101.103]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id d64si13218469yhn.3.2012.03.07.12.28.11; Wed, 07 Mar 2012 12:28:11 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: neutral (google.com: 69.132.101.103 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of phma@phma.optus.nu) client-ip=69.132.101.103; Received: from darner.ixazon.lan (darner.ixazon.lan [192.168.7.5]) by chausie (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EC40B13FBC for ; Wed, 7 Mar 2012 15:28:09 -0500 (EST) From: Pierre Abbat To: lojban@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: [lojban] Biological taxonomy and other 'esoteric' vocabularies like chemical nomenclature Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2012 15:28:01 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.13.5 (DragonFly/3.1-DEVELOPMENT; KDE/4.5.5; i386; ; ) References: <13652222.419.1331146240191.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@ynes7> In-Reply-To: <13652222.419.1331146240191.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@ynes7> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <201203071528.01767.phma@phma.optus.nu> X-Original-Sender: phma@phma.optus.nu X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=neutral (google.com: 69.132.101.103 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of phma@phma.optus.nu) smtp.mail=phma@phma.optus.nu Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Spam_score: -0.7 X-Spam_score_int: -6 X-Spam_bar: / All languages (except Latin itself, and maybe Greek from which many taxonomic roots come) treat biological taxonomic names the same way: they are marked as foreign (at least genus and species names) and (usually) undeclined. I know of two exceptions, virus species names and some unranked taxa of plants like rosids, both of which are in English, at least in English. Common names, such as English "geranium" and Lojban "plargoni", can be derived from (or in Romance languages, inherited from, such as Spanish "aves" and "avena") scientific names, but may not have the same taxonomic extent. Chemical nomenclature is a quite different beast. An IUPAC name of a complicated organic chemical is very much like a long lujvo, and very unlike the typical word formations of Indo-European and Semitic languages, which consist of a root, or a few roots joined together in IE, with a bunch of prefixes, suffixes, and inflections stuck on. I think, therefore, that IUPAC should be done with lujvo in Lojban. But there isn't much room left for all the affixes used in IUPAC. There are at least three ways numbers are used in IUPAC: the oxidation state or valence of an atom, the number of copies of a group in a molecule, and the atom to which a group is attached; and it's not clear to me how to distinguish them in Lojban. Take for instance 1,1,1- trichloro-2,2-di(4-chlorophenyl)ethane (aka DDT). The numerals denote which atom the chlorines and phenyls are attached to; the "di" and "tri" prefixes mean there are three chlorines and two chlorophenyls attached to the ethane. Pierre -- Jews use a lunisolar calendar; Muslims use a solely lunar calendar. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en.