wrote: > >> coi rodo >> >> So, I've been reading a lot of Terry Pratchett's Discworld series in the >> last week or so, which, those if any of you who are familiar with these >> books may be aware, are full of footnotes. A little asterisk at the end, or >> in the middle, of a sentence, corresponding to one at the bottom of the >> page, which explains the thing immediately preceding the one above, or >> tells some related story. Sometimes even the footnotes have footnotes. And, >> since these books are also reminding me of several things I want to use >> lojban for, the various strands of thought tangled together and I wondered >> how lojban would accomplish something similar. Would we merely use >> parentheticals, or would something else be more appropriate? >> >> mu'omi'e la .jdakrat.skaryzgik. >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "lojban" group. >> To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. >> > > > > -- > mu'o mi'e .aionys. > > .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o > (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D ) > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "lojban" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. --20cf307abf5d89907904bac56c79 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Huh how coincidental, I was discussing footnotes and endnotes in #lojban ju= st a few days ago.

It seems like there are many ways to do this, some o= f which use only standard lojban, and a few others which require experiment= al cmavo. I'd strongly prefer to see the first variety be used, natural= ly.

1) Works only after a sumti. [ko'a nesa'a zo= 9;e pe li xo'e], where xo'e is the number of the footnote/endnote. = Replacing [zo'e] with something more precise would allow for disambigua= tion in that regard. For "footnote" in particular, I'd sugges= t [ko'a nesa'a lo papri fanmo notci pe li xo'e]. The use of [sa= 'a] is perhaps optional.

2) Works anywhere. Wrap the following in a to/to'i.= ..toi: [e'u catlu zo'e pe li xo'e], where zo'e and xo'e= are replaced as in the previous solution. This solution is arguably less g= ood than #1, as when using a to...toi, I don't think that it's good= practice to refer to the surrounding text. Of course, using to'i...toi= is perhaps better.

3) Requires a new cmavo and works only after sumti. Let= xi'i be a cmavo of XI, meaning "see footnote".

4) Requires a new cmavo and works everywhere. Let mai'a be = a cmavo of MAI, meaning "see footnote".

5) Requires a new cmavo, uses nonstandard Lojban, and w= orks everywhere. Let xi'i be a cmavo of XI and let XI equate to a free = modifier.

These are the solutions that I can think= of; there are certainly more. Also, [xi'i] and [mai'a] are complet= ely made up, they aren't in jvovlaste or known by any lojbanists, unles= s of course someone else has been using one or the other or both for some o= ther purpose, in which case I apologise.

As for the text of the footnotes, there are many possib= ilities again. Each footnote could be individually wrapped in a TO...toi, o= r the full text of the footnotes could be wrapped in a single parenthetical= remark. Also, one could also simply use [ni'o]...[no'i] for the te= xt of the footnotes. This would be more inline with the solutions not invol= ving wrapping the footnote number in a parenthetical remark, as I believe t= hat it is bad to refer to the contents of a parenthetical remark from withi= n the main text. (IIRC, the CLL says not to do so as well.) I suggest using= [mai] to mark the number being used for the following text until another [= mai] is reached. If [mai] is already being used in the main text and confus= ion might result from using regular [mai], perhaps the footnotes could all = be negative numbers, in order to ensure that there's no confusion betwe= en a reference to a footnote and a reference to another section. Also, if [= mai] is being used in a situation where the text of a footnote contains a r= eference to a footnote, it would become impossible to use subscripting as s= uggested below. In that case, I would suggest using a zo'u-and-tu'e= ..tu'u system like so: {i lo papri fanmo notci pe li pa xi re zo'u = tu'e i li'o tu'u}. Using [ni'o] for each new footnote might= be a good idea as well, but this makes wrapping the whole footnote section= in [ni'o]...[no'i] more confusing.

As for footnotes within footnotes, (footnoteception? :P= ) it is possible to use subscripting to disambiguate, using any of the sol= utions mentioned above, except=A0the solutions involving [mai], as t= he number preceding [mai] cannot be subscripted. [mai] itself may not be su= bscripted either, unless the author adheres to XI-as-a-free-modifier (which= is nonstandard Lojban).

i ma se jinvi
mu'o mi'e la tsani

On 8 March 2012 19:34, Jonathan Jones <eyeonus@gmail.com> wrote:
Hey! .skaryzgik. is back! Hoorah!

Regarding your question, I'm p= retty sure we have header and footer cmavo, but I don't know what they = are nor have the time currently to look them up. Hopefully .xorxes. or Pier= re or Robin can provide better information on that.

On Thu, Mar 8, 2012 at 2:34 PM, Marjorie Sch= erf <skaryzgik@gmail.com> wrote:

coi rodo

So, I've been reading a lot of Terry Pratchett's Di= scworld series in the last week or so, which, those if any of you who are f= amiliar with these books may be aware, are full of footnotes. A little aste= risk at the end, or in the middle, of a sentence, corresponding to one at t= he bottom of the page, which explains the thing immediately preceding the o= ne above, or tells some related story. Sometimes even the footnotes have fo= otnotes. And, since these books are also reminding me of several things I w= ant to use lojban for, the various strands of thought tangled together and = I wondered how lojban would accomplish something similar. Would we merely u= se parentheticals, or would something else be more appropriate?

mu'omi'e la .jdakrat.skaryzgik.

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--
mu'o mi'e .aionys.
.i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo= 9;o
(Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )

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