Received: from mail-yw0-f61.google.com ([209.85.213.61]:56259) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1S8vpo-0000DY-Qz; Sat, 17 Mar 2012 08:46:25 -0700 Received: by yhkk25 with SMTP id k25sf7172614yhk.16 for ; Sat, 17 Mar 2012 08:46:18 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:date:from:to:message-id:in-reply-to:references:subject :mime-version:x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results :reply-to:precedence:mailing-list:list-id:x-google-group-id :list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=8dIEtZ0kR4h0pn/twyQzrM6c76GMcvbKlFQu6Qwm3Vw=; b=C7jgJncmqSdJhV5mqZmQTzIXZYszZOgbJhB0IjokXAN3xf+S4E9naHMoGxqCBr076U cfuGN7rQ6q2nESiUb7gnH+e0nDILQDipe67OKRkRwpA0yT/LrFdNXsRD4aW4f9IglcaC L355eBdoecZ8mkDhKILzsqqZANmHyawnSvYAs= Received: by 10.52.177.5 with SMTP id cm5mr553129vdc.16.1331999173807; Sat, 17 Mar 2012 08:46:13 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.220.218.147 with SMTP id hq19ls2701431vcb.4.gmail; Sat, 17 Mar 2012 08:46:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.52.177.5 with SMTP id cm5mr553128vdc.16.1331999173368; Sat, 17 Mar 2012 08:46:13 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sat, 17 Mar 2012 08:46:12 -0700 (PDT) From: gleki To: lojban@googlegroups.com Message-ID: <4209701.146.1331999172782.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@vbfl9> In-Reply-To: References: Subject: [lojban] Re: Equivocal tanru MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Original-Sender: gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: ls.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com designates internal as permitted sender) smtp.mail=gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com; dkim=pass header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_Part_145_27650972.1331999172781" X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Spam_score: -0.7 X-Spam_score_int: -6 X-Spam_bar: / ------=_Part_145_27650972.1331999172781 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 What texts are you gonna translate ? Are those texts in English ? If you want to translate "quick brown fox" why not say {bunre je sutra lorxu} ? It will mean brown=>fox<=quick whereby you will show that F (fox) is both semantically B (brown)-colored and Q (quick)-colored. But the relation between F and Q will remain unknown. On Saturday, March 17, 2012 6:04:14 PM UTC+4, Escape Landsome wrote: > > I asked some question which was not understood, so I ask it anew : > > a tanru X Y is some Y that has X-ness. it is not "X and Y" (unless > we play with the predicativity of X and Y), rather it is one Y, but > with X semantic coloration. > > If I want to speak about a X Y Z, that is, either a Z which is > somewhat like a X Y (in the tanru sense above), or a Y Z that is like > a X, --- but keeping myself deliberately equivocal, how do I proceed ? > > The way Lojban does seems to compel me to disambiguate, but what if I > WANT TO REMAIN AMBIGUOUS ? > > How do I say "little girls' school" in lojban WHEN I WANT TO REMAIN > AMBIGUOUS ? > > -- > > Please consider not this as a mere amusement of myself... If we want > to translate old books of yore in Lojban, we'll have to remain > equivocal with some "X's Y's Z" phrases, BECAUSE the books in which > they are written are equivocal themselves (and we ought not to > desambiguate things that are ambiguous). > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojban/-/BJQntjJ_NnYJ. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. ------=_Part_145_27650972.1331999172781 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable What texts are you gonna translate ? Are those texts in English ?
If yo= u want to translate 
"quick brown fox" why not say {bun= re je sutra lorxu} ?
It will mean 
brown=3D>fox= <=3Dquick
whereby you will show that F (fox) is both semantica= lly B (brown)-colored and Q (quick)-colored.
But the relation bet= ween F and Q will remain unknown.

On Saturday, March 17, 2012= 6:04:14 PM UTC+4, Escape Landsome wrote:
I asked some question which was not understood, so I ask it anew= :

a tanru X Y is some Y that has X-ness.   it is not "X and Y" (unl= ess
we play with the predicativity of X and Y), rather it is one Y, but<= br>with X semantic coloration.

If I want to speak about a X Y Z, that= is, either a Z which is
somewhat like a X Y (in the tanru sense above),= or a Y Z that is like
a X, --- but keeping myself deliberately equivoca= l, how do I proceed ?

The way Lojban does seems to compel me to disam= biguate, but what if I
WANT TO REMAIN AMBIGUOUS ?

How do I say "li= ttle girls' school" in lojban WHEN I WANT TO REMAIN AMBIGUOUS ?

--

Please consider not this as a mere amusement of myself...  If we w= ant
to translate old books of yore in Lojban, we'll have to remain
eq= uivocal with some "X's Y's Z" phrases, BECAUSE the books in which
they a= re written are equivocal themselves  (and we ought not to
desambigu= ate things that are ambiguous).

<= /blockquote>

--
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