Received: from mail-qc0-f189.google.com ([209.85.216.189]:38349) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1ShbOM-0002ZG-6h; Thu, 21 Jun 2012 00:01:24 -0700 Received: by qcsq5 with SMTP id q5sf266969qcs.16 for ; Thu, 21 Jun 2012 00:01:15 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=HvGBMRaQM3/ha+RL1oIAZnCtz8M741k1/hD8iUw3Jkg=; b=f81DN71Sw3w2gtFp8oB4cecj/Zb1o0k6Z9QOLompBLFm+6084Vq2Uvx+CC4+8NPLPC 9DRSNJLHLgF1f7qkm+ILBeoKUhH70GNsWRdx6iwUQU05eClxKJuEXyurP1BwwES3+A+4 2RjVh5QzSW9cShyUilgrnzvr1TR9Ys0UkBFcI= Received: by 10.236.72.97 with SMTP id s61mr2963623yhd.13.1340262075435; Thu, 21 Jun 2012 00:01:15 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.236.128.9 with SMTP id e9ls273979yhi.9.gmail; Thu, 21 Jun 2012 00:01:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.100.80.2 with SMTP id d2mr13937309anb.0.1340262074231; Thu, 21 Jun 2012 00:01:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.100.80.2 with SMTP id d2mr13937307anb.0.1340262074216; Thu, 21 Jun 2012 00:01:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-yw0-f41.google.com (mail-yw0-f41.google.com [209.85.213.41]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id v25si11712691yhm.0.2012.06.21.00.01.14 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Thu, 21 Jun 2012 00:01:14 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of escaaape@gmail.com designates 209.85.213.41 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.213.41; Received: by yhr47 with SMTP id 47so247262yhr.0 for ; Thu, 21 Jun 2012 00:01:14 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.50.94.133 with SMTP id dc5mr6561812igb.16.1340262073943; Thu, 21 Jun 2012 00:01:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.64.15.74 with HTTP; Thu, 21 Jun 2012 00:01:13 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <000eea56-0a1e-4f54-8862-3cc817d539e1@googlegroups.com> References: <74243394-F7AA-46CD-B731-21E95827CE6B@yahoo.com> <5fbb3fd1-8c00-42a4-9dac-e9889e69757f@googlegroups.com> <000eea56-0a1e-4f54-8862-3cc817d539e1@googlegroups.com> Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2012 09:01:13 +0200 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] Re: Are Natlang the best case for entropy in communication ? From: Escape Landsome To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: escaaape@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of escaaape@gmail.com designates 209.85.213.41 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=escaaape@gmail.com; dkim=hardfail header.i=@googlemail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Spam_score: -0.7 X-Spam_score_int: -6 X-Spam_bar: / > Stop being an asshole. We all know that Lojban has problems. You're harpi= ng > on this like you expect everybody to drop everything and say, [SNIP] > and you can stop bleeding the wound. You don't need to be blunt. You react like a believer whose faith is attacked. In any case, I don't attack YOU, nor even your "faith", but would you say that a man that would complain to Russell about problems with the set y =3D {x | x =E2=88=89 x} would be "an asshole" ? Well, he would be if you take the things too much emotionally, but I rather think he would be a great scientist. Here I point the necessity of adapting the mechanism of redundancy in lojbanic communication. There IS some problem. The fact that Natlangs do have some glimpses of this problem too is not relevant, because in most case this concerns pairs of concepts very near such as "ran"/"run" where the unguessable feature is [PAST]/[PRESENT]. But here so'V =3D QUANTITY =3D { all, none, many, a few ... } is A WHOLE PARADIGM. It's up to you to consider I overlook that, but I tend to think you are too much emotionally involved in your reaction. Ought to be more scientifically-minded... --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den.