Received: from mail-pb0-f61.google.com ([209.85.160.61]:64607) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1Shewy-0004Gm-65; Thu, 21 Jun 2012 03:49:28 -0700 Received: by pbbro2 with SMTP id ro2sf1564191pbb.16 for ; Thu, 21 Jun 2012 03:49:14 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=yC8jE9dwmhijp68kcmXqARGLSvjkfzlS/E2cO8r2Gck=; b=QF/guO7ojh+TyzsIOBSqUii4A6zj+d9pi8MD9o6gyVduv+j3tFT7jOO3Rde8dlW/M7 LIKoz94k0YtC0M4IhQV62iKjNx6adQt5YXAg/40iM5q+wmQaa1guhM094OMLzEWjA5UP yNJ4iEVcvKUZdMwyexPeYbgapc/83ogPvgTrk= Received: by 10.236.157.166 with SMTP id o26mr1862358yhk.10.1340275753791; Thu, 21 Jun 2012 03:49:13 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.236.138.163 with SMTP id a23ls493135yhj.4.gmail; Thu, 21 Jun 2012 03:49:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.236.73.131 with SMTP id v3mr48837969yhd.6.1340275752783; Thu, 21 Jun 2012 03:49:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.236.73.131 with SMTP id v3mr48837967yhd.6.1340275752773; Thu, 21 Jun 2012 03:49:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-gg0-f180.google.com (mail-gg0-f180.google.com [209.85.161.180]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id b73si18477304yhh.4.2012.06.21.03.49.12 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Thu, 21 Jun 2012 03:49:12 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of escaaape@gmail.com designates 209.85.161.180 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.161.180; Received: by ggnf1 with SMTP id f1so275777ggn.25 for ; Thu, 21 Jun 2012 03:49:12 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.50.237.72 with SMTP id va8mr6356787igc.17.1340275752450; Thu, 21 Jun 2012 03:49:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.64.15.74 with HTTP; Thu, 21 Jun 2012 03:49:12 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <9cb9e4c0-f3fa-4183-8582-f14de670148c@googlegroups.com> References: <74243394-F7AA-46CD-B731-21E95827CE6B@yahoo.com> <5fbb3fd1-8c00-42a4-9dac-e9889e69757f@googlegroups.com> <000eea56-0a1e-4f54-8862-3cc817d539e1@googlegroups.com> <9cb9e4c0-f3fa-4183-8582-f14de670148c@googlegroups.com> Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2012 12:49:12 +0200 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] Re: Are Natlang the best case for entropy in communication ? From: Escape Landsome To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: escaaape@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of escaaape@gmail.com designates 209.85.161.180 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=escaaape@gmail.com; dkim=pass header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Spam_score: -0.7 X-Spam_score_int: -6 X-Spam_bar: / We have no reason to get upset because on ONE PARTICULAR point natlangs behave better than lojban. There is even a chance that lojban can be amended in a way it behaves better then natlangs after the amendment. Suppose for instance we are given a new consonant "q", one could state that from now there is a strict equivalence between the phonological sequences "a" and "aqa" "e" and "eqe" "i" and "iqi" "o" and "oqo" "u" and "uqu" Thus, so'a and so'e can be confused in a noisy environement, but saying so'aqa ou so'eqe would avoid that. This is a simple example to show you that discussing a drawback of lojban does not mean being mean towards it, rather it is what is expected from anybody here : that is, being scientific and examine closely and open-mindedly any problem. [I don't think the solution I proposed is a good one, either. But at least it shows this is no dead-end street question. And also we've no need to be aggressive. Meanwhile, natlangs are still better than lojban on the entropy topic] -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en.