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Subject: Re: [lojban] {fa'a} and expressing "towards" in Lojban.
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On Sunday, June 24, 2012 10:23:24 PM UTC+4, selpa'i wrote:
>
> Am 24.06.2012 20:08, schrieb Robin Lee Powell: 
> > The original context was using {mi dundu ti fa'a do} to mean "I give 
> > ti towards/to you", which is definitely wrong; the fa'a has nothing 
> > to do with the ti, and even if it did, I can certainly place 
> > something on a table away from you and say {mi dunda ti do}, since 
> > dunda is about possession in the abstract and not about handing you 
> > something, IMO. 
>
> {fa'a} refers to {dunda}, not to {ti}. Otherwise you need {be} being added.

{mi dunda ti fa'a do} means "The event of me giving this (to somebody) 
> is faced towards you." This does not tell us who the recipient is, so it 
> is different from {mi dunda ti do}. 
>
I completely agree.  {mi dunda ti fa'a do} is a more ambiguous way to 
say {mi dunda ti do}.
Although in most (not all !) cases context will tell that both sentences 
denote the same.

>
> > So, how *do* we walk about the facing of objects in a bridi? 
>
> You can simply use NOI and NE: 
>
> {.i mi noi se farna do cu dunda ti do} 
> or: {.i mi ne fa'a do cu dunda ti do} 
>
> {.i mi dunda ti noi se farna } 
> or: {.i mi dunda ti ne fa'a mi do} 
>
> etc. for all the other possible permutations. 
>
> Similarly for "I walk towards you, but backwards", you can do one of the 
> following: 
> .i mi cadzu fa'a do fau lo nu mi to'e se farna do 
> .i mi noi to'e se farna do cu cadzu fa'a do 
> .i mi fau lo nu lo crane cu trixe cu cadzu fa'a do 
> etc. 
>
> mu'o mi'e la selpa'i 
>
> -- 
> .i pau mi me ma .i pa mai ko mi jungau la'e di'u 
> .i ba bo mi va'o lo nu nelci lo nu me ma kau cu barkla 
> .i va'o lo nu na nelci cu denpa ti lo nu mi drata 
>
>
>
>

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<br><br>On Sunday, June 24, 2012 10:23:24 PM UTC+4, selpa'i wrote:<blockquo=
te class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0;margin-left: 0.8ex;border-left:=
 1px #ccc solid;padding-left: 1ex;">Am 24.06.2012 20:08, schrieb Robin Lee =
Powell:
<br>&gt; The original context was using {mi dundu ti fa'a do} to mean "I gi=
ve
<br>&gt; ti towards/to you", which is definitely wrong; the fa'a has nothin=
g
<br>&gt; to do with the ti, and even if it did, I can certainly place
<br>&gt; something on a table away from you and say {mi dunda ti do}, since
<br>&gt; dunda is about possession in the abstract and not about handing yo=
u
<br>&gt; something, IMO.
<br>
<br></blockquote><div>{fa'a} refers to {dunda}, not to {ti}. Otherwise you =
need {be} being added.</div><div><br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote=
" style=3D"margin: 0;margin-left: 0.8ex;border-left: 1px #ccc solid;padding=
-left: 1ex;">{mi dunda ti fa'a do} means "The event of me giving this (to s=
omebody)=20
<br>is faced towards you." This does not tell us who the recipient is, so i=
t=20
<br>is different from {mi dunda ti do}.
<br></blockquote><div>I completely agree. &nbsp;{mi dunda ti fa'a do} is a =
more ambiguous way to say&nbsp;{mi dunda ti do}.</div><div>Although in most=
 (not all !) cases context will tell that both sentences denote the same.</=
div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0;margin-left: 0.8ex=
;border-left: 1px #ccc solid;padding-left: 1ex;">
<br>&gt; So, how *do* we walk about the facing of objects in a bridi?
<br>
<br>You can simply use NOI and NE:
<br>
<br>{.i mi noi se farna do cu dunda ti do}
<br>or: {.i mi ne fa'a do cu dunda ti do}
<br>
<br>{.i mi dunda ti noi se farna }
<br>or: {.i mi dunda ti ne fa'a mi do}
<br>
<br>etc. for all the other possible permutations.
<br>
<br>Similarly for "I walk towards you, but backwards", you can do one of th=
e=20
<br>following:
<br>.i mi cadzu fa'a do fau lo nu mi to'e se farna do
<br>.i mi noi to'e se farna do cu cadzu fa'a do
<br>.i mi fau lo nu lo crane cu trixe cu cadzu fa'a do
<br>etc.
<br>
<br>mu'o mi'e la selpa'i
<br>
<br>--=20
<br>.i pau mi me ma .i pa mai ko mi jungau la'e di'u
<br>.i ba bo mi va'o lo nu nelci lo nu me ma kau cu barkla
<br>.i va'o lo nu na nelci cu denpa ti lo nu mi drata
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br></blockquote>

<p></p>

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