Received: from mail-qa0-f56.google.com ([209.85.216.56]:62256)
	by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128)
	(Exim 4.76)
	(envelope-from <lojban+bncCJS3ppUjEJWp5_8EGgRV44xk@googlegroups.com>)
	id 1SnwRI-0007vy-MP; Sun, 08 Jul 2012 11:42:42 -0700
Received: by qaas11 with SMTP id s11sf2898108qaa.1
        for <multiple recipients>; Sun, 08 Jul 2012 11:42:30 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
        d=googlegroups.com; s=beta;
        h=x-beenthere:date:from:to:cc:message-id:in-reply-to:references
         :subject:mime-version:x-original-sender
         :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list
         :list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender
         :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type;
        bh=qngoYxTzEag4Y3SKHBhYqvpcmBACVSe8H95pk2PE4b4=;
        b=qmklWc0218kFwdkGSXjMMioCNb4hBLSIP/SFVuruKH7OQdBQ77G/q0RXy2mfCdE576
         j2Je4VVOHJ5t05epxTAM7pkguSEp07G2Tntlo8t/Wu/ZNk+Xi4cqgbIFBasCPalyfqlH
         GNusjdSZbRGpmZFWbFONDybqPreqasKOVvfbg=
Received: by 10.68.216.163 with SMTP id or3mr2988180pbc.1.1341772949764;
        Sun, 08 Jul 2012 11:42:29 -0700 (PDT)
X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com
Received: by 10.68.240.172 with SMTP id wb12ls8608572pbc.3.gmail; Sun, 08 Jul
 2012 11:42:28 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by 10.68.134.71 with SMTP id pi7mr2136510pbb.19.1341772948879;
        Sun, 08 Jul 2012 11:42:28 -0700 (PDT)
Date: Sun, 8 Jul 2012 11:42:28 -0700 (PDT)
From: "la .lindar." <lindarthebard@gmail.com>
To: lojban@googlegroups.com
Cc: lojban-list@lojban.org
Message-Id: <b5ff6c68-1414-4cd9-98ca-8f1693ee1e15@googlegroups.com>
In-Reply-To: <20120708071832.GU3566@stodi.digitalkingdom.org>
References: <20120708071832.GU3566@stodi.digitalkingdom.org>
Subject: [lojban] Re: jbonunsla 2012: Post #2
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-Original-Sender: lindarthebard@gmail.com
X-Original-Authentication-Results: ls.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of
 lindarthebard@gmail.com designates internal as permitted sender)
 smtp.mail=lindarthebard@gmail.com; dkim=pass
 header.i=@gmail.com
Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com
Precedence: list
Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com
List-ID: <lojban.googlegroups.com>
X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417
List-Post: <http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/post?hl=en_US>, <mailto:lojban@googlegroups.com>
List-Help: <http://groups.google.com/support/?hl=en_US>, <mailto:lojban+help@googlegroups.com>
List-Archive: <http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en_US>
Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com
List-Subscribe: <http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/subscribe?hl=en_US>, <mailto:lojban+subscribe@googlegroups.com>
List-Unsubscribe: <http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/subscribe?hl=en_US>, <mailto:googlegroups-manage+1004133512417+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; 
	boundary="----=_Part_17_7901312.1341772948066"
X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/)
X-Spam_score: -0.7
X-Spam_score_int: -6
X-Spam_bar: /

------=_Part_17_7901312.1341772948066
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

Oh dear gods people! They were notes, not commandments handed down from the 
gods.
I was mostly marking it down here because Robin asked me to.

I *promise* you that we're not having a mini ACTA in here about Lojban.
There are going to be lots of videos and shit posted up after the event.
You will all get to have your say. You can all pitch a fit once that's done.

Regarding my previous notes:
1. "Your friend is in the middle of leaving and walks back into the room to 
get his keys." - pretty much the only time to use {tolcliva}, otherwise 
{mo'u klama}. I personally really wish people wouldn't try to encode 
time-tense into the selbri as it's stylistically shitty and reeks of 
tense-conjugation in natlangs.
2. It's all opinion and we're going to discuss it more later once we 
actually start making these changes, which won't happen until AFTER the CLL 
is done.
3. Robin and I had a stylistic disagreement and we had agreed to not 
nitpick if he says {barda temci} and I say {clani temci}.
4. Ask Byron/Robin. I think it was like {mi dikni lo nu catra lo ka catra 
le nintadni kei lo cacra be li re} or {.i gonai do dunda le jdini mi gi mi 
dikni lo ka catra le pinfu be mi kei lo mentu be li cino}. Also, STOP 
MAKING NEW CMAVO. Use the existing language that we have before you come up 
with superfluous nonsense. Some of the words you've invented are perfectly 
valid and necessary, but when you're solution to any problem perceived, new 
or old, is to coin a new cmavo, you're clearly doing something wrong. Stop 
it, please. Present evidence that it *can't* be done with the existing 
vocabulary and grammar before you invent new words, because it looks like 
"Hey, let's coin a new cmavo for this!" is your first solution, otherwise 
we're just going to ignore it.
5. It's a discussion. We haven't done anything yet.
6. That...
7. Still need ideas on this one.

Stuff we need to discuss tomorrow:
1. Still am going to do that at some point.
2. Y'all read way too much into things. I didn't say, "Discuss re-coding or 
replacing JVS.". If you want JVS2 then go code it and stop waiting on us to 
fix everything. I can promise you that JVS2 is not going to get an ounce of 
our attention until after CLL 1.1 is done. You are all welcome to 
accelerate either process using your own time and energy. I was going to 
bring up simple ways to manage it better and what our existing policies are 
on modifying/cleaning up entries and adding examples.

*raaaaaaeeeeeeeeeeeg*

tl;dr Calm down. We're not breaking the language without you. Just be 
patient.

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojban/-/1OJZQ2m9XfUJ.
To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en.


------=_Part_17_7901312.1341772948066
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Oh dear gods people!&nbsp;They were notes, not commandments handed down fro=
m the gods.<div>I was mostly marking it down here because Robin asked me to=
.</div><div><br></div><div>I *promise* you that we're not having a mini ACT=
A in here about Lojban.</div><div>There are going to be lots of videos and =
shit posted up after the event.</div><div>You will all get to have your say=
. You can all pitch a fit once that's done.</div><div><br></div><div>Regard=
ing my previous notes:</div><div>1. "Your friend is in the middle of leavin=
g and walks back into the room to get his keys." - pretty much the only tim=
e to use {tolcliva}, otherwise {mo'u klama}. I personally really wish peopl=
e wouldn't try to encode time-tense into the selbri as it's stylistically s=
hitty and reeks of tense-conjugation in natlangs.</div><div>2. It's all opi=
nion and we're going to discuss it more later once we actually start making=
 these changes, which won't happen until AFTER the CLL is done.</div><div>3=
. Robin and I had a stylistic disagreement and we had agreed to not nitpick=
 if he says {barda temci} and I say {clani temci}.</div><div>4. Ask Byron/R=
obin. I think it was like {mi dikni lo nu catra lo ka catra le nintadni kei=
 lo cacra be li re} or {.i gonai do dunda le jdini mi gi mi dikni lo ka cat=
ra le pinfu be mi kei lo mentu be li cino}. Also, STOP MAKING NEW CMAVO. Us=
e the existing language that we have before you come up with superfluous no=
nsense. Some of the words you've invented are perfectly valid and necessary=
, but when you're solution to any problem perceived, new or old, is to coin=
 a new cmavo, you're clearly doing something wrong. Stop it, please. Presen=
t evidence that it *can't* be done with the existing vocabulary and grammar=
 before you invent new words, because it looks like "Hey, let's coin a new =
cmavo for this!" is your first solution, otherwise we're just going to igno=
re it.</div><div>5. It's a discussion. We haven't done anything yet.</div><=
div>6. That...</div><div>7. Still need ideas on this one.</div><div><br></d=
iv><div>Stuff we need to discuss tomorrow:</div><div>1. Still am going to d=
o that at some point.</div><div>2. Y'all read way too much into things. I d=
idn't say, "Discuss re-coding or replacing JVS.". If you want JVS2 then go =
code it and stop waiting on us to fix everything. I can promise you that JV=
S2 is not going to get an ounce of our attention until after CLL 1.1 is don=
e. You are all welcome to accelerate either process using your own time and=
 energy. I was going to bring up simple ways to manage it better and what o=
ur existing policies are on modifying/cleaning up entries and adding exampl=
es.</div><div><br></div><div>*raaaaaaeeeeeeeeeeeg*</div><div><br></div><div=
>tl;dr Calm down. We're not breaking the language without you. Just be pati=
ent.</div>

<p></p>

-- <br />
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "=
lojban" group.<br />
To view this discussion on the web visit <a href=3D"https://groups.google.c=
om/d/msg/lojban/-/1OJZQ2m9XfUJ">https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojban/-/1O=
JZQ2m9XfUJ</a>.<br />=20
To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.<br />
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou=
ps.com.<br />

For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban=
?hl=3Den.<br />



------=_Part_17_7901312.1341772948066--