On Wed, Jul 25, 2012 at 1:21 PM, selpa&#= 39;i <seladwa@gmx.de> wrote:

=20 =20 =20
Am 25.07.2012 18:39, schrieb Marica Odagaki:

xu ki'a lu .itkuile li'u xelso jboski and vlasisku doesn't parse ".itkuile" and neither do I,=A0to whom Lojban is still Greek.
vlasisku is not a parser. It can only decompose lujvo, but this is a zi'evla based on Ithkuil (the language). Am 25.07.2012 19:07, schrieb Gleki Arxokuna: How shall we define it? Wiktionary says Greek (uncountable) Unintelligible speech or text, such as foreign speech or text, or regarding subjects the listener is not familiar with, such as mathematics or technical jargon; or statements that the listener does not understand or agree with. .e'u {.itkuile - =A0x1 (quoted text/object) is unintelligible [for x2]} Now I wonder if there is any need in this word when {jimpe} does the same. The definition needs to be more specific. That is possible, but quite terrible. You seem to be overlooking the joke (or I am seeing a joke where there is none). .itkuile: x1 pertains to Ithkuil in aspect x2 =A0
It's funny when used as "this is so complicated, I can't understand it", but defining it that way removes some of the metaphorical character from the expression. Of course, you'd get some laughs when someone looks it up expecting it to mean "x1 pertains to Ithkuil [..]" only to find this joke-definition. Happens somewhat regularly with the many other joke-brivla when someone looks them up on IRC.
I d= on't like the idea of having "joke-brivla" in which the offic= ial definition and the use are different. One compromise is to have the wor= d mean "complicated and confusing" but have a note in its definit= ion about its etymology. Another is to recognize that there is an elided {p= e'a} in that usage and be careful using it. One of the things I _like_ about lojban is its _lack_ of idiomatic/meta= phoric/undocumented constructs that make it difficult for learners to achie= ve proficiency.
mu'o mi'e la selpa'i --=20 .i pau mi me ma .i pa mai ko mi jungau la'e di'u=20 .i ba bo mi va'o lo nu nelci lo nu me ma kau cu barkla=20 .i va'o lo nu na nelci cu denpa ti lo nu mi drata -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups &= quot;lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojba= n?hl=3Den.