Received: from mail-gg0-f189.google.com ([209.85.161.189]:60073)
	by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128)
	(Exim 4.76)
	(envelope-from <lojban+bncCJzE7b_XFxDmjbuBBRoENJaYTw@googlegroups.com>)
	id 1T2V7V-0003wJ-R8; Fri, 17 Aug 2012 15:34:30 -0700
Received: by ggcs5 with SMTP id s5sf4487720ggc.16
        for <multiple recipients>; Fri, 17 Aug 2012 15:34:15 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
        d=googlegroups.com; s=beta;
        h=x-beenthere:date:from:to:message-id:subject:mime-version
         :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to
         :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post
         :list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe
         :content-type;
        bh=6yqEU+gb1gQeEAfC+rTYZ1qZIkVBAEamX0KBCt6sbiE=;
        b=BDZWtEpzQIsHbxk6U8JDoKr7u9jrHQ2Q0msCEduYuGkIIwHcf6Fn2N/dlxtSILdT4J
         MHmWriuwGZzEITatc0IQi4EzFXPLaXdu2ueD74KNM81jYC0vYz5CNpkWxrfZRYBDJSHh
         aB+AQoo0CylkRj3+y15h/qCjKOS3qZrme2UpQ=
Received: by 10.229.69.3 with SMTP id x3mr361455qci.20.1345242855003;
        Fri, 17 Aug 2012 15:34:15 -0700 (PDT)
X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com
Received: by 10.229.106.74 with SMTP id w10ls5784876qco.6.gmail; Fri, 17 Aug
 2012 15:34:14 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by 10.229.135.74 with SMTP id m10mr363005qct.23.1345242854221;
        Fri, 17 Aug 2012 15:34:14 -0700 (PDT)
Date: Fri, 17 Aug 2012 15:34:12 -0700 (PDT)
From: djandus <jandew@gmail.com>
To: lojban@googlegroups.com
Message-Id: <e9f11b0b-d319-4735-9f0a-38919d8262ce@googlegroups.com>
Subject: [lojban] "turn on"
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-Original-Sender: jandew@gmail.com
X-Original-Authentication-Results: ls.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of
 jandew@gmail.com designates internal as permitted sender)
 smtp.mail=jandew@gmail.com; dkim=pass
 header.i=@gmail.com
Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com
Precedence: list
Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com
List-ID: <lojban.googlegroups.com>
X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417
List-Post: <http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/post?hl=en_US>, <mailto:lojban@googlegroups.com>
List-Help: <http://groups.google.com/support/?hl=en_US>, <mailto:lojban+help@googlegroups.com>
List-Archive: <http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en_US>
Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com
List-Subscribe: <http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/subscribe?hl=en_US>, <mailto:lojban+subscribe@googlegroups.com>
List-Unsubscribe: <http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/subscribe?hl=en_US>, <mailto:googlegroups-manage+1004133512417+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; 
	boundary="----=_Part_1664_31337237.1345242852442"
X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/)
X-Spam_score: -0.7
X-Spam_score_int: -6
X-Spam_bar: /

------=_Part_1664_31337237.1345242852442
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

coi rodo

A while back I was trying to translate an appliance "turning on" and it was 
brought to my attention that there's not much agreement on the subject. 
After discussing the various hacks people have been using, and what it 
actually is supposed to mean, we ended up trying to come up with a word for 
"x1 performs its intended function/purpose x2" -- the word I eventually 
suggested was {zilpli}. This usage would imply that when "turn on" is used 
in a context that could be described as "begins to use", {pilno} could be 
used.

e.g. {.i mi co'a pilno lo ve tivni .i babo ri ca'o zilpli} could be "I 
turned on the TV. Afterwards, it remained on."
Other Lojban options had issues with metaphorical usage or not being 
general enough to discuss other states of "on-ness" -- tenses work very 
well with {zilpli}. It also describes appliances as tools that can operate 
without an operator, which I find very clean and simple.

Are there any objections to this, or shall I submit the word to jbovlaste 
with the gloss word "turn on" as in "performs intended function"?

Note that I also feel {zilpli} helps fill the void of describing a person 
having a "purpose" without a deity/creator/user. But that's philosophical, 
and besides the main point of submitting the word.

mu'o mi'e djos

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojban/-/asB0wZt-HacJ.
To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en.


------=_Part_1664_31337237.1345242852442
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

coi rodo<div><br></div><div>A while back I was trying to translate an appli=
ance "turning on" and it was brought to my attention that there's not much =
agreement on the subject. After discussing the various hacks people have be=
en using, and what it actually is supposed to mean, we ended up trying to c=
ome up with a word for "x1 performs its intended function/purpose x2" -- th=
e word I eventually suggested was {zilpli}. This usage would imply that whe=
n "turn on" is used in a context that could be described as "begins to use"=
, {pilno} could be used.</div><div><br></div><div>e.g. {.i mi co'a pilno lo=
 ve tivni .i babo ri ca'o zilpli} could be "I turned on the TV. Afterwards,=
 it remained on."</div><div>Other Lojban options had issues with metaphoric=
al usage or not being general enough to discuss other states of "on-ness" -=
- tenses work very well with {zilpli}. It also describes appliances as tool=
s that can operate without an operator, which I find very clean and simple.=
</div><div><br></div><div>Are there any objections to this, or shall I subm=
it the word to jbovlaste with the gloss word "turn on" as in "performs inte=
nded function"?</div><div><br></div><div>Note that I also feel {zilpli} hel=
ps fill the void of describing a person having a "purpose" without a deity/=
creator/user. But that's philosophical, and besides the main point of submi=
tting the word.</div><div><br></div><div>mu'o mi'e djos</div>

<p></p>

-- <br />
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "=
lojban" group.<br />
To view this discussion on the web visit <a href=3D"https://groups.google.c=
om/d/msg/lojban/-/asB0wZt-HacJ">https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojban/-/as=
B0wZt-HacJ</a>.<br />=20
To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.<br />
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou=
ps.com.<br />

For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban=
?hl=3Den.<br />



------=_Part_1664_31337237.1345242852442--