Received: from mail-fa0-f61.google.com ([209.85.161.61]:57587) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1T5LgH-0001MS-Hy; Sat, 25 Aug 2012 12:06:08 -0700 Received: by fada11 with SMTP id a11sf964566fad.16 for ; Sat, 25 Aug 2012 12:05:54 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=20120806; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:message-id:date:from:user-agent :mime-version:to:subject:references:in-reply-to:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=0i2BeAdgF97bgWTcJWV0fCwL7L2ow5yGP/f3Z+eaa1k=; b=y53Y9EUVl8a9kZnMulTZwAZ0CLAGiKFBnujQMyx7BUp+tsccmx7nqfvWikIEUn4p1L NDDVn8dW2vzy25T5R8M5xzigPVx9/xloSQov1iuM85/2uaWIu6dGy4s7u5JgfzFNWYd1 txrjcyFFvGFZTFCXZGRPk//cU84xZqgLNe6KADPmbdFVLlO/qe6QDKtDz/YdjwKDoD3c yFnn9hXbKn0Z+Nx6ScEBl9v9xej67NGZ1MQ5U8hjAHubIEK2Tfu3BnV5pjsc1vFUFa0m oBnjRAgZEKyqnhEHhrPOoPczbyJ54V23AZzN+KAwaNEMi/ZUleJO1fGDCovB9EixsUmJ cWgw== Received: by 10.216.133.72 with SMTP id p50mr23767wei.42.1345921552356; Sat, 25 Aug 2012 12:05:52 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.14.213.71 with SMTP id z47ls745839eeo.6.gmail; Sat, 25 Aug 2012 12:05:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.14.220.131 with SMTP id o3mr7323006eep.6.1345921551744; Sat, 25 Aug 2012 12:05:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.14.220.131 with SMTP id o3mr7323005eep.6.1345921551735; Sat, 25 Aug 2012 12:05:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ey0-f170.google.com (mail-ey0-f170.google.com [209.85.215.170]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id v3si18651420eep.1.2012.08.25.12.05.51 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Sat, 25 Aug 2012 12:05:51 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of and.rosta@gmail.com designates 209.85.215.170 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.215.170; Received: by eaao11 with SMTP id o11so919127eaa.15 for ; Sat, 25 Aug 2012 12:05:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.14.211.3 with SMTP id v3mr11686253eeo.43.1345921551636; Sat, 25 Aug 2012 12:05:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.1.77] (87-194-76-177.bethere.co.uk. [87.194.76.177]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id v3sm39029777eep.10.2012.08.25.12.05.49 (version=SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Sat, 25 Aug 2012 12:05:50 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <5039220D.4030304@gmail.com> Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2012 20:05:49 +0100 From: And Rosta User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; en-US; rv:1.9.2.28) Gecko/20120306 Thunderbird/3.1.20 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: lojban@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: [lojban] "Any" and {ro} References: <44e6fb5c-91f3-47ba-817c-8560c9c6ca14@googlegroups.com> <502B9E61.8060808@gmx.de> <502BA634.3030007@gmx.de> <502C50EB.3090704@gmail.com> <7e604d79-8ecd-4690-bc39-bf48b601d46f@googlegroups.com> <5036D423.5050101@gmail.com> <34c8db6a-3ddd-48cb-b36c-2748ed06d72d@googlegroups.com> <20120825132428.GB25027@samsa> In-Reply-To: <20120825132428.GB25027@samsa> X-Original-Sender: and.rosta@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of and.rosta@gmail.com designates 209.85.215.170 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=and.rosta@gmail.com; dkim=pass header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Spam_score: -0.7 X-Spam_score_int: -6 X-Spam_bar: / v4hn, On 25/08/2012 14:24: > On Fri, Aug 24, 2012 at 07:15:35AM -0700, la gleki wrote: >> I think logic can't define the difference between "one of..." and "any". >> There for {xe'e} in PA would be strange. >> What are your objections against {su'a}? >> >> {da} - some apple in the basket. >> {da su'a} - any apple in the basket. >> {da su'anai} - some specific apple in the basket (e.g. the yellow one). > > .i mi mutce nelci di'u > .i xu di'u drani loka fanva kei fo rodo The objections to this {su'a} idea is that it's trying to express a logical= distinction by searching through the dictionary to find words with vaguely= relevant glosses (such as "particular"), finding some discourse markers gl= ossed in that way, and arbitrarily inventing new uses for those discourse m= arkers in the hope that they will magically express the desired meaning. It= 's the {da'i} bollocks all over again. --And. --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den.