On Sat, Sep 22, 2012 at 9:20 AM, la gleki <gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com> wrote:

On Friday, Septemb= er 14, 2012 2:35:41 AM UTC+4, tsani wrote:
Actually, those two examples don't relate as much as you'd like. Vi= sion occurs when light reflects off an object into the eye, and is afterwar= d processed by the brain (the brain does *a lot* of work to see). "See= ing events" doesn't make much sense, because sight is just a primi= tive based on capturing light. You see the object regardless of its state.<= /blockquote>

OK, how would you say "I see an apple fallin= g"?=A0
=

As for desire, this can only apply to states. Wanting an app= le doesn't really mean *anything*. Seeing an apple does.

=
.i mi'e la tsani mu'o

On 13 September 2012 14:32, la gleki <gleki.is...@g= mail.com> wrote:

On Thursday, September 13, 2012 8:07:23 PM UTC+4, stevo wrote:
=

On Thu, Sep 13, 2012 at 10:17 AM, la gleki <gleki.i= s...@gmail.com> wrote:

When we say "I see y= ou" we actually mean "I see you standing/present in front of me/{= co'e}/whatever".

I don't understand why you think "I see you&qu= ot; is short for a longer phrase, especially one that is too specific and o= ften simply not true.=A0

I just think the sentence "I want [to eat] an apple" is somewhat = parallel to "I see you [standing]". If in the first one we must u= se {tu'a} then the same should be true for the second sentence.

stevo

So {mi viska do} is just a ha= ndy emulation of natlangs when it should really be expressed as {mi viska t= u'a do}. But as some lojbanists already do this illegal trick then let&= #39;s make it official.

Therefore=A0
{mi ganse lo du'u crino} - I= sense something as being green (i.e. I see it).
{mi ganse lo du&= #39;u lo cladu ku crino} -=A0=A0I sense some loud object as green (i.e. I s= ee it)

{mi ganse [tu'a] lo cladu}=A0=A0 - I sense some loud object = [nothing is said how I sense it, it's might be a synonym of the previou= s example].

So there is no conflict between th= e object and the type of sensing it.=A0In first case you use {tu'a} or = just drop it. In the second case you use {lo su'u/nu/du'u/...}

We have no gismu for TASTE ( {vrusi} has no place for = experiencer) and TOUCH-FEEL ({pencu} is now what we need. when i touch {ko&= #39;a} with a screwdriver i touch-feel the screwdriver but touch=A0{ko'= a}=A0).

We would also need=A0to allow=A0in=A0{sumne2}=A0not only the object be= ing smelled but the type of smell and abstraction for the combination of th= e object and it's smell.
=A0

=A0
<= br>
On Sunday, July 15, 2012 12:37:26 AM UTC+4, Robin Powell wrot= e:
On Sat, Jul 14, 2012 at 01:32:54PM -0700, djandus wrote:
> On Friday, November 18, 2011 3:48:51 PM UTC-6, xorxes wrote:
> >
> > On Fri, Nov 18, 2011 at 5:15 AM, Robin Lee Powell wrote:
> > > This is really interesting stuff! =A0Can you make sure i= t
> > > appears on some appropriate BPFK page?
> > >
> > > I completely agree with you about zgana, and I'm inc= lined to
> > > agree with you about ganse; make sure they get notes in = the
> > > gismu setion please.
> > =A0
> > I'm not in much of a wiki-editing mood l= ately, so I'll leave
> > that to somepony else.
> >
> Dude, did this really never get done?

I linked to the thread on the gismu issues page, a few hours ago.

-Robin

--=20
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