Received: from mail-pb0-f61.google.com ([209.85.160.61]:42963) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1TYdXh-00016x-Bc; Wed, 14 Nov 2012 06:02:27 -0800 Received: by mail-pb0-f61.google.com with SMTP id wz12sf459449pbc.16 for ; Wed, 14 Nov 2012 06:02:06 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=20120806; h=x-beenthere:date:from:to:message-id:in-reply-to:references:subject :mime-version:x-original-sender:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=3lexsiwpwXVV/9psH78sINIxD8XNLRxYgP3fxtJzGGA=; b=hpzAnQ5VW8xTCxKy6Nxw5C4Y148KFbSUpslSMsLPgPDN/EOsqMCprdg/SnrRymuiQf yqnXxbAaEbKHZMo2KOeuVJlDd4Trc/ADY2Cu2KPf/iatgpEY+EAZECZ1Wbc0HK5uG32G IjaooxrB1+DhQj3tJfOBj8RW5ep4U2ZmUffno+2VUs3PmC4HvMNWzQZYiUf55SlrqLLg 8Y68cSjH7HyEGnPJ8wk4Jl5kq9czVOfeC4CdkvyoLAQj6GrOirpF5N5WWQQsE/VUWFaN QAQyr35T+1E+0EXhqXgXUuiy6TB+Lv/ub8d0/uxdOWpokI91NKs0dQuYhqO3zxH4pCB5 +vkQ== Received: by 10.52.91.109 with SMTP id cd13mr177517vdb.15.1352901725653; Wed, 14 Nov 2012 06:02:05 -0800 (PST) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.220.107.208 with SMTP id c16ls370706vcp.3.gmail; Wed, 14 Nov 2012 06:02:03 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.52.71.82 with SMTP id s18mr177105vdu.9.1352901723948; Wed, 14 Nov 2012 06:02:03 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2012 06:02:03 -0800 (PST) From: la gleki To: lojban@googlegroups.com Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <20121113194725.GL22972@sunflowerriver.org> References: <98ac3a8c-7f91-4049-a8ee-128f9a947671@googlegroups.com> <60b24557-d28a-4330-91e2-4fa350f35cbd@googlegroups.com> <6cb197db-5690-48fb-8a88-3e633bb6f94b@googlegroups.com> <285a3908-97fd-4231-8767-479dd0779da8@googlegroups.com> <20121113171712.GG22972@sunflowerriver.org> <699d8b9d-2f04-4a0a-b2cf-a9f498ac19fd@googlegroups.com> <20121113194725.GL22972@sunflowerriver.org> Subject: Re: [lojban] Re: A new Lojbanic wiki (LMW). On the threshold of the 25th anniversary of Lojban MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Original-Sender: gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_Part_767_24247248.1352901723623" X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Spam_score: 0.0 X-Spam_score_int: 0 X-Spam_bar: / ------=_Part_767_24247248.1352901723623 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Lojbananas, I've switched off my creative mind recently so my future work on LMW will be exclusively described as "add and add and add... and stupidly add more content". So my questions. 1. If you want ALL the pages from the old wiki migrated please contact *camgusmis or other people that have access to TikiWiki* *yourself *to get a dump of all pages. If you can show that your method of importing it back to your own distribution of mediawiki works then of course together with me we'll import all the pages to LMW. 1a. If you (tsani + me + probably some other jbopre) don't like pages for geeks being present there why not move them into a separate namespace or just prefix them with "Pages for developers/" or similar string? 2. What plugins do you currently need? SemanticMW.... got it. anything else? On Tuesday, November 13, 2012 11:47:05 PM UTC+4, .alyn.post. wrote: > > I like the suggestion of a {{cleanup}} template. I've been working > on general workflow templates over at OpenCog: > > http://wiki.opencog.org/w/Curation > > And they are similar to this idea. You can mark a page as a > {{stub}}, mark it as work in progress ({{WIP}})* write it until > it's a {{proposal}}, and then {{withdraw}} it if it's a bad idea > or tag it with a {{version}} if it becomes a feature. Later work > may cause it to be {{obsolete}} and if you don't keep it in sync > it might get {{out of date}}. > > These templates also take care to register the pages in the > appropriate namespaces, so a curator can see which pages are in > which categories. I like workflow processes like this because any > effort has a 'long tail' of incomplete, partial, bad, and promising > ideas that don't quite fit into the existing structure of the wiki. > > mi'e .alyn. > > * = adding that is on my list, it doesn't exist yet. > > On Tue, Nov 13, 2012 at 11:29:43AM -0800, vruxir wrote: > > I'm of the opinion that it would benefit a future Wiki if it has > imported > > ALL the contents from the TWiki. If that can be done automatically, > then > > hopefully there's also a way to automatically place a "Cleanup" box > at the > > top of each imported article, saying something to the effect of: > > "This article was imported from the old lojban.org Tiki Wiki and may > not > > meet the content and style guidelines of this Wiki. Please see our > > _content and style guidelines_ and clean up this article. If you feel > that > > the article is named inappropriately, the article can be moved to a > new > > name. Do not remove this tag until the article is up to standards." > > Then you'll want to have some content and style guidelines, probably > > inspired by Wikipedia or other successful Wikis. > > (When you move an article to a new name, the old name becomes a > redirect; > > if you replace the old name with a new article, you can insert tags > at the > > top of the article with suggestions to visit the moved article. See, > for > > example, the top of the article [1] > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defamation > > ) > > If there is a debate about what a word really MEANS, then I would > think > > the article about that word needs to report the differing viewpoints > > (including CLL's viewpoint) and what level of support the viewpoints > > have. Then the actual continuing debate over the meaning of the word > could > > go in the Discussion tab, OR if it's possible to create another tab > with a > > more appropriate name (e.g. "Grammar Debate"), do that and leave the > > Discussion tab for talking about the quality of the article itself. > > By importing all the TWiki content to the new Wiki (and marking them > all > > for "cleanup"), you can safely redirect people from the TWiki to the > new > > Wiki if/when it has been demonstrated that the new Wiki is superior, > and > > you don't have to worry about losing important discussions. > > mu'o mi'e vruxir > > On Tuesday, November 13, 2012 12:16:51 PM UTC-5, .alyn.post. wrote: > > > > On Tue, Nov 13, 2012 at 04:21:14AM -0800, la gleki wrote: > > > * We're making a fresh start, so why not keep it clean? > > > > To be contrary a moment, > > > > I've put a lot of work in writing and organizing TWiki pages. I'm > > happy to have them migrated to mediawiki, but I'm more-or-less > being > > told that the work I've done on TWiki isn't valuable ("fresh > start"). > > Any work I would do on the new wiki would need to access/refer to/ > > modify the pages I have worked on than are in TWiki. > > > > I'd love to have them imported to Mediawiki, but as things stand I > feel > > like work I've put into the wiki is more-or-less being deleted (you > can > > call it archiving if you want) and I'm wondering what the heck I > would > > be expected to do with the new wiki when all the content I want to > work > > on is in the old wiki. > > > > mi'e .alyn. > > -- > > .i ma'a lo bradi cu penmi gi'e du > > > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups > > "lojban" group. > > To view this discussion on the web visit > > [2]https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojban/-/01evXYCxTw8J. > > To post to this group, send email to loj...@googlegroups.com. > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > lojban+un...@googlegroups.com . > > For more options, visit this group at > > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. > > > > References > > > > Visible links > > 1. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defamation > > 2. https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojban/-/01evXYCxTw8J > > -- > .i ma'a lo bradi cu penmi gi'e du > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojban/-/WCfLQSvTsUQJ. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. ------=_Part_767_24247248.1352901723623 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Lojbananas, I've switched off my creative mind recently so my future work o= n LMW will be exclusively described as "add and add and add... and stupidly= add more content".

So my questions.
1. If you= want ALL the pages from the old wiki migrated please contact camgusmis = or other people that have access to TikiWiki yourself to ge= t a dump of all pages. If you can show that your method of importing it bac= k to your own distribution of mediawiki works then of course together with = me we'll import all the pages to LMW.
1a. If you (tsani + me + pr= obably some other jbopre) don't like pages for geeks being present there wh= y not move them into a separate namespace or just prefix them with "Pages f= or developers/" or similar string?

2. What plugins= do you currently need?
SemanticMW.... got it.
anything= else?

On Tuesday, November 13, 2012 11:47:05 PM UTC+4, .alyn.post. = wrote:
I like the suggestion of= a {{cleanup}} template.  I've been working
on general workflow templates over at OpenCog:

  http://wiki.opencog.org/w/Curation

And they are similar to this idea.  You can mark a page as a
{{stub}}, mark it as work in progress ({{WIP}})* write it until
it's a {{proposal}}, and then {{withdraw}} it if it's a bad idea
or tag it with a {{version}} if it becomes a feature.  Later work
may cause it to be {{obsolete}} and if you don't keep it in sync
it might get {{out of date}}.

These templates also take care to register the pages in the
appropriate namespaces, so a curator can see which pages are in
which categories.  I like workflow processes like this because any
effort has a 'long tail' of incomplete, partial, bad, and promising
ideas that don't quite fit into the existing structure of the wiki.

mi'e .alyn.

* =3D adding that is on my list, it doesn't exist yet.

On Tue, Nov 13, 2012 at 11:29:43AM -0800, vruxir wrote:
>    I'm of the opinion that it would benefit a future Wik= i if it has imported
>    ALL the contents from the TWiki. If that can be done = automatically, then
>    hopefully there's also a way to automatically place a= "Cleanup" box at the
>    top of each imported article, saying something to the= effect of:
>    "This article was imported from the old lojban.org Tiki Wiki and may not
>    meet the content and style guidelines of this Wiki. P= lease see our
>    _content and style guidelines_ and clean up this arti= cle. If you feel that
>    the article is named inappropriately, the article can= be moved to a new
>    name. Do not remove this tag until the article is up = to standards."
>    Then you'll want to have some content and style guide= lines, probably
>    inspired by Wikipedia or other successful Wikis.
>    (When you move an article to a new name, the old name= becomes a redirect;
>    if you replace the old name with a new article, you c= an insert tags at the
>    top of the article with suggestions to visit the move= d article. See, for
>    example, the top of the article [1]http://en.wikipedia.org= /wiki/Defamation
>    )
>    If there is a debate about what a word really MEANS, = then I would think
>    the article about that word needs to report the diffe= ring viewpoints
>    (including CLL's viewpoint) and what level of support= the viewpoints
>    have. Then the actual continuing debate over the mean= ing of the word could
>    go in the Discussion tab, OR if it's possible to crea= te another tab with a
>    more appropriate name (e.g. "Grammar Debate"), do tha= t and leave the
>    Discussion tab for talking about the quality of the a= rticle itself.
>    By importing all the TWiki content to the new Wiki (a= nd marking them all
>    for "cleanup"), you can safely redirect people from t= he TWiki to the new
>    Wiki if/when it has been demonstrated that the new Wi= ki is superior, and
>    you don't have to worry about losing important discus= sions.
>    mu'o mi'e vruxir
>    On Tuesday, November 13, 2012 12:16:51 PM UTC-5, .aly= n.post. wrote:
>=20
>      On Tue, Nov 13, 2012 at 04:21:14AM -0800, la g= leki wrote:
>      >        * We're making= a fresh start, so why not keep it clean?
>=20
>      To be contrary a moment,
>=20
>      I've put a lot of work in writing and organizi= ng TWiki pages.  I'm
>      happy to have them migrated to mediawiki, but = I'm more-or-less being
>      told that the work I've done on TWiki isn't va= luable ("fresh start").
>      Any work I would do on the new wiki would need= to access/refer to/
>      modify the pages I have worked on than are in = TWiki.
>=20
>      I'd love to have them imported to Mediawiki, b= ut as things stand I feel
>      like work I've put into the wiki is more-or-le= ss being deleted (you can
>      call it archiving if you want) and I'm wonderi= ng what the heck I would
>      be expected to do with the new wiki when all t= he content I want to work
>      on is in the old wiki.
>=20
>      mi'e .alyn.
>      --
>      .i ma'a lo bradi cu penmi gi'e du
>=20
>    --
>    You received this message because you are subscribed = to the Google Groups
>    "lojban" group.
>    To view this discussion on the web visit
>    [2]https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojb= an/-/01evXYCxTw8J.
>    To post to this group, send email to loj...@goo= glegroups.com.
>    To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
>    lojban+un...@googlegroups.com.
>    For more options, visit this group at
>    http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=3Den= .
>=20
> References
>=20
>    Visible links
>    1. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defamation
>    2. https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojb= an/-/01evXYCxTw8J

--=20
.i ma'a lo bradi cu penmi gi'e du

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojban/-/WC= fLQSvTsUQJ.
=20 To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den.
------=_Part_767_24247248.1352901723623--