Received-SPF: neutral (google.com: 209.85.223.174 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of alanpost@sunflowerriver.org) client-ip=209.85.223.174;
Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2012 11:09:07 -0700
From: ".alyn.post." <alyn.post@lodockikumazvati.org>
To: lojban@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [lojban] Novel written system that parallels the logic of Lojban?
Message-ID: <20121121180932.GM27366@sunflowerriver.org>
Mail-Followup-To: lojban@googlegroups.com
References: <291e8942-2309-4343-b7ff-a56ac60c320a@googlegroups.com>
 <CAMKwHj0K85LkV8gkCxRrSG+JZrdf2DUkiCUQi0akB_7QqvjfSw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAKOEKkQ+Uzx+gJTBPEtyk-3zJNSZpqW6_SGn2H+GpC+yrNWFNw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAMKwHj1fMHOiMXn+R718u142yEK+P0GnzBrFQ-x8D0T0N0ZRCQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAKOEKkSus4NzWY90iJppy6xVnpEUm_QyDwBCF2fHJNaDtYn8Qg@mail.gmail.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <CAKOEKkSus4NzWY90iJppy6xVnpEUm_QyDwBCF2fHJNaDtYn8Qg@mail.gmail.com>
Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com
Precedence: list
Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com
Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Disposition: inline
X-Spam_score: -0.0
X-Spam_score_int: 0
X-Spam_bar: /

I've wanted to explore a system like that for a a Signed Exact
Lojban signing/writing system, since the 'alphabet' of signed
language is so much larger.

  http://www.lojban.org/tiki/Lojban+Sign+Language

mi'e .alyn.

On Wed, Nov 21, 2012 at 01:00:00PM -0500, Michael Turniansky wrote:
>    But I disagree that it is similar. *Larlermorna (which I use for my gmail
>    avatar) is based on letters/phonemes, as are all the alternate
>    orthographies. *Charlicopter was suggesting a system built around
>    "Lojbanic structure, syntax, logic, etc." *Completely*different idea.
>    * * * --gejyspa
>    On Wed, Nov 21, 2012 at 12:54 PM, Jonathan Jones <[1]eyeonus@gmail.com>
>    wrote:
> 
>      On Wed, Nov 21, 2012 at 10:46 AM, Michael Turniansky
>      <[2]mturniansky@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>        * Actually, Jonathan, I would have dismissed it too, as "oh, great,
>        another suggestion for a writing system" *But this one was actually
>        different. *It's suggesting that rather than a simply one-to-one
>        substitution of the existing orthography to another letter-based
>        system, that we basically give each brivla a single symbol, based on
>        things such as place value, so that, for example, each of the danlu
>        gismu might look similar, since they have similar terbri. * It's an
>        intriguing suggestion, but I doubt there's much support for it.
>        * * * * * * *--gejyspa
> 
>      I wasn't dismissing it. I told him to Google larlermorna because that
>      writing system is similar to what he described.
> 
>      I agree that there isn't likely going to be much support for such a
>      system.
>      *
> 
>        On Wed, Nov 21, 2012 at 11:34 AM, Jonathan Jones
>        <[3]eyeonus@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>          Google "larlermorna".
> 
>          On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 4:43 PM, [4]charlicopter@gmail.com
>          <[5]lanternsmith@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>            Greetings everyone,
>            This is my first time visiting the forums...
>            My curiosity currently lies in the possibility of a written system
>            that could be developed around Lojban that respects its logical
>            nature.
>            As far as I can tell in my rudimentary beginnings as a student of
>            Lojban: The language is designed around phonetics in a similar way
>            to Japanese. by that, I mean that the language uses predictable
>            and consistent combinations of vowel and consonant phonetics in
>            the structure of the constituent word-forms.
> 
>            Preposition: In written Lojban, what if you used a character
>            system similar to Japanese hiragana and katakana:
>            [6]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katakana* &*
>            [7]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hiragana
>            Japanese Katakana and Hiragana are based on characters which hail
>            from ancient cultural influences, but what if you started fresh
>            and designed characters around some kind of logical analysis of
>            Lojbanic structure, syntax, logic, etc. such that the characters
>            are themselves always internally consistent and logical?
>            Pictorally speaking, you have many variables to draw upon: stroke
>            length, angle, curvature, dots, rotation/orientation, etc.
>            certainly as many variables as are needed to accurately represent
>            the phonetics, syntax etc. of the language. In this way, entire
>            gismu might have a chance of being reduced to single characters
>            which LOOK and FLOW as logically as they behave.
> 
>            Thoughts?
> 
>            --
>            You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>            Groups "lojban" group.
>            To view this discussion on the web visit
>            [8]https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojban/-/RSMpezF6avUJ.
>            To post to this group, send email to [9]lojban@googlegroups.com.
>            To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
>            [10]lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
>            For more options, visit this group at
>            [11]http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en.
> 
>          --
>          mu'o mi'e .aionys.
> 
>          .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o
>          (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )
> 
>          --
>          You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>          Groups "lojban" group.
>          To post to this group, send email to [12]lojban@googlegroups.com.
>          To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
>          [13]lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
>          For more options, visit this group at
>          [14]http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en.
> 
>        --
>        You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>        Groups "lojban" group.
>        To post to this group, send email to [15]lojban@googlegroups.com.
>        To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
>        [16]lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
>        For more options, visit this group at
>        [17]http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en.
> 
>      --
>      mu'o mi'e .aionys.
> 
>      .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o
>      (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )
> 
>      --
>      You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>      Groups "lojban" group.
>      To post to this group, send email to [18]lojban@googlegroups.com.
>      To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
>      [19]lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
>      For more options, visit this group at
>      [20]http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en.
> 
>    --
>    You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>    "lojban" group.
>    To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
>    To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
>    lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
>    For more options, visit this group at
>    http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en.
> 
> References
> 
>    Visible links
>    1. mailto:eyeonus@gmail.com
>    2. mailto:mturniansky@gmail.com
>    3. mailto:eyeonus@gmail.com
>    4. mailto:charlicopter@gmail.com
>    5. mailto:lanternsmith@gmail.com
>    6. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katakana
>    7. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hiragana
>    8. https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojban/-/RSMpezF6avUJ
>    9. mailto:lojban@googlegroups.com
>   10. mailto:lojban%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com
>   11. http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en
>   12. mailto:lojban@googlegroups.com
>   13. mailto:lojban%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com
>   14. http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en
>   15. mailto:lojban@googlegroups.com
>   16. mailto:lojban%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com
>   17. http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en
>   18. mailto:lojban@googlegroups.com
>   19. mailto:lojban%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com
>   20. http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en

-- 
.i ma'a lo bradi cu penmi gi'e du

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group.
To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en.