Received: from mail-vc0-f189.google.com ([209.85.220.189]:64606) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1TeuKh-00068H-9M; Sat, 01 Dec 2012 13:10:58 -0800 Received: by mail-vc0-f189.google.com with SMTP id p16sf728604vcq.16 for ; Sat, 01 Dec 2012 13:10:36 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=20120806; h=x-beenthere:date:from:to:message-id:in-reply-to:references:subject :mime-version:x-original-sender:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=DN6LLEsy2Ms1x22ndSrM82K3ubchjlyXZASICgQEVRo=; b=BoRe+1u713S1Yj5mR1gPUP2On1LpUsjRNlzJ4inm344MgefBEGJjBqKmjtgN54RLw+ y7Qf6zlR/ya5BsQhbPAowZmXOXgXUjRZ5zOAt0x8QzxbBSslEEwZ1YJTTvZmhgmn458T 3Qxx3WbHDqMCtsFS96AkEiBA4foE97uPyPEe9C2ndD+hNpMFMvGQU/QQLxo3WkGnh1ed U4BvT9XEaQJdEDNkI7C9nFLXaGHP2MOkjuBoMKDLuwSwUlCT7qEit2BlKDH5aR7Q8cCr mnymdezeYst20GdyYU/0DdbV1VnPHbk5VxqABny39t7yiQyEAMkEOyHWhreqhqfel4o6 oGUQ== Received: by 10.49.75.9 with SMTP id y9mr1322981qev.9.1354396236136; Sat, 01 Dec 2012 13:10:36 -0800 (PST) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.49.4.194 with SMTP id m2ls1028853qem.22.gmail; Sat, 01 Dec 2012 13:10:35 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.49.15.38 with SMTP id u6mr1344572qec.8.1354396235186; Sat, 01 Dec 2012 13:10:35 -0800 (PST) Date: Sat, 1 Dec 2012 13:10:34 -0800 (PST) From: vruxir To: lojban@googlegroups.com Message-Id: <21b9a5dc-7104-4b01-ac4a-3271e3000c8b@googlegroups.com> In-Reply-To: <016d8978-9681-4d55-af4b-543a79abe45f@googlegroups.com> References: <98ac3a8c-7f91-4049-a8ee-128f9a947671@googlegroups.com> <60b24557-d28a-4330-91e2-4fa350f35cbd@googlegroups.com> <6cb197db-5690-48fb-8a88-3e633bb6f94b@googlegroups.com> <285a3908-97fd-4231-8767-479dd0779da8@googlegroups.com> <20121113171712.GG22972@sunflowerriver.org> <699d8b9d-2f04-4a0a-b2cf-a9f498ac19fd@googlegroups.com> <20121113194725.GL22972@sunflowerriver.org> <7c389416-3ceb-4d21-9b6b-e4e1cb5d312f@googlegroups.com> <2d4db499-3585-4456-b7c7-6a6846d6bcee@googlegroups.com> <8f8fac5c-9085-48eb-8793-d0e536e45f85@googlegroups.com> <016d8978-9681-4d55-af4b-543a79abe45f@googlegroups.com> Subject: Re: [lojban] Re: A new Lojbanic wiki (LMW). On the threshold of the 25th anniversary of Lojban MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Original-Sender: kextrii@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_Part_265_5635001.1354396234820" X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Spam_score: 0.0 X-Spam_score_int: 0 X-Spam_bar: / ------=_Part_265_5635001.1354396234820 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Earlier today I was having a technical issue with translating -- basically,= =20 after editing and saving a "message" in the translation interface, a dialog= =20 box would pop up with a "tpt-unknown-page" error. However, now the problem= =20 has disappeared and translating works again, so I'm not sure what caused it= . Another problem, as I try to add a new page, is that I can't upload images= =20 (specifically, I'm trying to add standard Wikimedia message box images,=20 such as the "!" information bubble and a pencil-and-paper icon). Upon=20 clicking the "Upload" button at the bottom, I get: Upload Warning: Could not create directory=20 "mwstore://local-backend/local-public/7/7e". Many people seem to think that it's a problem with folder write=20 permissions. There is discussion=20 here: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Thread:Project:Support_desk/Trouble_upl= oading_after_installation (The same type of error message came up for both .svg and .png files.) mu'o On Saturday, December 1, 2012 4:34:58 AM UTC-5, la gleki wrote: > > > > On Saturday, December 1, 2012 1:18:15 PM UTC+4, iesk wrote: >> >> Le samedi 1 d=E9cembre 2012 01:03:26 UTC+1, entot a =E9crit : >>> >>> It's not a question of if the default language is English or not. It's = a=20 >>> question of whether we present a Lojban-only page to a newcomer. I thin= k=20 >>> showing a Lojbanic interface and Lojban-only content to a newcomer is n= ot=20 >>> friendly. >>> >> (I guess its 'friendlier' than piping interested people through English= =20 >> when it isn't necessary.) >> =20 >> >>> >>> If the primary language is Lojban, are you, doi la gleki. .e la .iesk.,= =20 >>> fine with importing all the pages from TWiki to LMW? Lots of them are i= n=20 >>> English. >>> >> >> Since I have so far not contributed anything useful to LMW, my opinion= =20 >> does not weigh much. >> >> I repeat that my idea of the wiki was that there be no 'primary language= '=20 >> for content pages. Everybody would write pages in the language(s) of the= ir=20 >> preference. I don't think it likely that there will be systematic=20 >> translations of all LMW pages in all LMW languages (whichever that may b= e).=20 >> Most content will probably be in English anyway (TWiki imports included)= ,=20 >> who would translate all that stuff? So why not have a page in, say, Fren= ch,=20 >> link to relevant pages in, say, English, Lojban, =85 I have been arguin= g=20 >> *against* any primary language, because that would, to my understanding,= =20 >> mean that you have to write (or wait for somebody to write) a page about= =20 >> 'broda' in the primary language before you can add a page about 'broda' = in=20 >> the language that you want. >> > > Unfortunately I have no idea of a mechanism of creating a wiki without an= y=20 > primary language. And LMW is after all a linguistic project. The core of= =20 > Lojbanistan is Lojban which is a language. Anyway LMW-contributors must= =20 > know at least some basic lojban. This will be enough to create new pages = in=20 > simple lojban first and then creating it's "translation" in another=20 > language e.g. English. > > *UPDATE:* > I already noticed first attempts of spamming in LMW from anonymous users.= =20 > Threrefore > ConfirmEdit extension installed to prevent spamming. ReCaptcha mode=20 > activated for new users. It makes us dependent on third-party ReCaptcha= =20 > service, but it's the simplest solution. > > > >> =20 >> >>> >>> ni'o >>> >>> I'm holding off any work I said or hinted I'd be doing (working on the= =20 >>> community portal and migrating) until I get a clear picture of what the= =20 >>> site organization is going to be [1]: >>> >>> * Who is the target audience? >>> * What content will it have, in what language? >>> >>> As far as I understand, there are two interests at hand: >>> >>> * Target audience: Lojban speakers >>> * Content: Anything in Lojban? / Translation projects, Lojbanic=20 >>> writings, Lojbanists index >>> >>> * Target audience: Lojban learners >>> * Content: Learning materials in English and other languages around the= =20 >>> world >>> >> >> I na=EFvely thought of a home for all things Lojbanic. ;) >> =20 >> >>> >>> If this is the case, I think it's not out of the question to maintain= =20 >>> two separate wikis for each: lojban.org and ckule.lojban.org. In=20 >>> MediaWiki, there is a way to share the extensions folder and such to le= ssen=20 >>> the admininstrative task. If there are corresponding pages between the = two,=20 >>> they can be linked to each other in the way Wikipedia links pages in ot= her=20 >>> languages. >>> >>> Any thoughts? >>> >>> [1] This is partly an excuse to focus my time on helping CLL1.1; I'm no= t=20 >>> a good multitasker. >>> >>> mu'o >>> >> --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lo= jban/-/dkiQHf15m7wJ. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den. ------=_Part_265_5635001.1354396234820 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Earlier today I was having a technical issue with translating -- basically,= after editing and saving a "message" in the translation interface, a dialo= g box would pop up with a "tpt-unknown-page" error. However, now the proble= m has disappeared and translating works again, so I'm not sure what caused = it.

Another problem, as I try to add a new page, is that= I can't upload images (specifically, I'm trying to add standard Wikimedia = message box images, such as the "!" information bubble and a pencil-and-pap= er icon). Upon clicking the "Upload" button at the bottom, I get:

Upload Warning: Could not create directory "mwstore://= local-backend/local-public/7/7e".

Many people seem= to think that it's a problem with folder write permissions. There is discu= ssion here: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Thread:Project:Support_desk/= Trouble_uploading_after_installation

(The same typ= e of error message came up for both .svg and .png files.)

mu'o

On Saturday, December 1, 2012 4:34:58 AM UTC-5, la glek= i wrote:


On Saturday, D= ecember 1, 2012 1:18:15 PM UTC+4, iesk wrote:
Le samedi 1 d=E9cembre 2012 01:03:26 UTC+1, entot a =E9crit = :
It's not a question of if the= default language is English or not. It's a question of whether we present = a Lojban-only page to a newcomer. I think showing a Lojbanic interface and = Lojban-only content to a newcomer is not friendly.
(= I guess its 'friendlier' than piping interested people through English when= it isn't necessary.)
 

UPDATE:
I already noticed first a= ttempts of spamming in LMW from anonymous users. Threrefore
ConfirmEdit = extension installed to prevent spamming. ReCaptcha mode activated for new u= sers. It makes us dependent on third-party ReCaptcha service, but it's the = simplest solution.



 

ni'o

I'm holdi= ng off any work I said or hinted I'd be doing (working on the community por= tal and migrating) until I get a clear picture of what the site organizatio= n is going to be [1]:

* Who is the target audience= ?
* What content will it have, in what language?

As far as I understand, there are two interests at hand:

* Target audience: Lojban speakers
* Content: Any= thing in Lojban? / Translation projects, Lojbanic writings, Lojbanists inde= x

* Target audience: Lojban learners
* C= ontent: Learning materials in English and other languages around the world<= /div>

I na=EFvely thought of a home for all things Loj= banic. ;)
 

<= /div>
If this is the case, I think it's not out of the question to main= tain two separate wikis for each: lojban.org and ckule.lojban.org. In MediaWiki, there is a way to share the extens= ions folder and such to lessen the admininstrative task. If there are corre= sponding pages between the two, they can be linked to each other in the way= Wikipedia links pages in other languages.

Any tho= ughts?

[1] This is partly an excuse to focus my ti= me on helping CLL1.1; I'm not a good multitasker.

= mu'o

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojban/-/dk= iQHf15m7wJ.
=20 To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den.
------=_Part_265_5635001.1354396234820--