Received: from mail-da0-f61.google.com ([209.85.210.61]:38941) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1ThlH7-0003lY-RN; Sun, 09 Dec 2012 10:06:57 -0800 Received: by mail-da0-f61.google.com with SMTP id z8sf1650226dad.16 for ; Sun, 09 Dec 2012 10:06:43 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=20120806; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from :date:message-id:subject:to:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=MZubFCqNf/43pcmv5hLERXaqeXS1fnmIP3aSkfxA7Go=; b=PfJ7iebSLIJNKK81eEEqRA8BsZ/XDxYya61ULxlu4bm4eRqpjHYbiEB8KGsBs2fw5c h84umjG9y7RDLrOYXoeiDQPWL8bxs1HknWn1gVajbWAbGRZloSnvne1gWLX0KZDdp3o4 3tfDGacTZf/Rk1+Lveh9jVgzYfR4NT1OtpDXOXeAdEkLvJXyfOOpSBm3KVJVsAApVBPv EAeblsGI2eOs+Q+2cCtc68tADhvYGu+g+0tjurumeFLho0hPmuoSF7tZWCh+4g4XOIK3 rQsCO66Wr6FSabEXQArQzuhQoGMdUDaQG554A8Qv7LTpi80Q8b7Q76jkJh5gveu0pe3e 5Gkg== DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from :date:message-id:subject:to:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=MZubFCqNf/43pcmv5hLERXaqeXS1fnmIP3aSkfxA7Go=; b=yWpMwxg97rwCriSoEVyIqSrswYtdGIlhfRpWdTOho30eNe0+te/KX5Eqa4wCoDmj/X enISo8aDSqAsAmtLzTltUTapczFI0jR2yR2gGr/dbGlxLb0I/Q0yUk2rgbhsMs6Q2Hpi kmW3ndwcL7WGg7lElX9wpjwVZ9XWjlmwN2r3yYPY9dMh/E3HbMO8ISQK0BmIAKjgjRdm jGdu43arg2g7vLsbrG54vRchA9PpDb7o7a1StsG/qzBeFwnbETR+gcZKQ8yzBE5fvdAl OjzrLGB3g6soOSwaqcH2BFDz03gSi7bybKENM8htvxP8wTj1FoP0WaZJFg7sfHJogJ/D 5qJw== Received: by 10.49.15.6 with SMTP id t6mr2512879qec.20.1355076403403; Sun, 09 Dec 2012 10:06:43 -0800 (PST) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.49.0.176 with SMTP id 16ls3333078qef.41.gmail; Sun, 09 Dec 2012 10:06:42 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.58.210.198 with SMTP id mw6mr3742855vec.22.1355076402097; Sun, 09 Dec 2012 10:06:42 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.58.210.198 with SMTP id mw6mr3742853vec.22.1355076402072; Sun, 09 Dec 2012 10:06:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-vc0-f170.google.com (mail-vc0-f170.google.com [209.85.220.170]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id dj17si2328712vdb.1.2012.12.09.10.06.42 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Sun, 09 Dec 2012 10:06:42 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of nictytan@gmail.com designates 209.85.220.170 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.220.170; Received: by mail-vc0-f170.google.com with SMTP id fl11so1955586vcb.29 for ; Sun, 09 Dec 2012 10:06:42 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.52.175.167 with SMTP id cb7mr6613327vdc.58.1355076401923; Sun, 09 Dec 2012 10:06:41 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.52.65.233 with HTTP; Sun, 9 Dec 2012 10:06:20 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <5E45BBBC-0430-4A29-89AF-6ECD6B59022F@evertype.com> References: <5E45BBBC-0430-4A29-89AF-6ECD6B59022F@evertype.com> From: Jacob Errington Date: Sun, 9 Dec 2012 13:06:20 -0500 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] sei To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: nictytan@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of nictytan@gmail.com designates 209.85.220.170 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=nictytan@gmail.com; dkim=pass header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=bcaec515912594848904d06f4fa2 X-Spam-Score: -0.1 (/) X-Spam_score: -0.1 X-Spam_score_int: 0 X-Spam_bar: / --bcaec515912594848904d06f4fa2 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 The metalinguistic aside is a "degenerate bridi". By that, I mean that it ends when the main selbri of that bridi is encountered. e.g. {.i mi do prami [sei mi stace]} = {.i [sei mi stace] mi do prami} This means that the sei-bridi cannot have a bridi-tail, and therefore no trailing sumti. To remedy this, you can inject sumti directly into the selbri by means of linkargs, with {be} & co. e.g. {.i mi ba'o klama lo zarci sei mi cusku be fi lo mamta} If your sei-clause comes directly before the main selbri, there's the obvious issue of an accidental tanru forming: e.g. {.i mi sei mi stace * prami do} the accidental tanru forms at *. This is the motivation for sei's terminator, se'u: e.g. {.i mi sei mi stace se'u prami do} .i mi'e la tsani mu'o On 7 December 2012 16:49, Michael Everson wrote: > When a metalinguistic aside is begun with "sei", how do you know when it > ends? > > Michael Everson * http://www.evertype.com/ > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "lojban" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. --bcaec515912594848904d06f4fa2 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable The metalinguistic aside is a "degenerate bridi". By that, I mean= that it ends when the main selbri of that bridi is encountered.
e.g. {= .i mi do prami [sei mi stace]} =3D {.i [sei mi stace] mi do prami}
This means that the sei-bridi cannot have a bridi-tail, and therefore no tr= ailing sumti. To remedy this, you can inject sumti directly into the selbri= by means of linkargs, with {be} & co.
e.g. {.i mi ba'o k= lama lo zarci sei mi cusku be fi lo mamta}
If your sei-clause comes directly before the main selbri, there's = the obvious issue of an accidental tanru forming:
e.g. {.i mi sei= mi stace * prami do} the accidental tanru forms at *.
This is th= e motivation for sei's terminator, se'u:
e.g. {.i mi sei mi stace se'u prami do}

.= i mi'e la tsani mu'o

On 7 = December 2012 16:49, Michael Everson <everson@evertype.com> wrote:
When a metalinguistic aside is begun with &q= uot;sei", how do you know when it ends?

Michael Everson * ht= tp://www.evertype.com/

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