Show original > > *His kids are (must be) ill* [i.e., as implied by some other fact such as= =20 his staying home from work]. {lo panzi be do ku bilma sei se sinxa} {lo panzi be do ku bilma sei se ve djuno} *5.2.8* *ASC* *The Ascriptive* The ASCRIPTIVE mood functions identically to the IMPLICATIVE immediately=20 above, except that the factuality of the inference derived from the=20 underlying presupposition is uncertain. Examples: *His kids may be ill* [i.e., as implied by some other fact such as his=20 staying home from work]. {lo panzi be do ku bilma sei se sinxa sei cumki} {lo panzi be do ku bilma sei se ve djuno sei cumki} =20 --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lo= jban/-/IO_VanAWVwIJ. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den. ------=_Part_1052_25703060.1356874079541 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

On Sunday, December 30, 2012 5:27:17 PM UTC+4, la gleki wrote:

This is an abridged e= xtract from Ithkuil grammar.

Note that Ithkuil is very p= recise in it's affixes and it's often impossible to drop out words that are= known from context anyway. Therefore, the translations to lojban are lengt= hy. It's only Ithkuil that causes this.

Again note tha= t you might wanna replace {sei} with {xoi} or {fi'o se}. I don't care.
<= table width=3D"45%" border=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0" style=3D"outline:0px;bac= kground-color:transparent;border-collapse:collapse">5.2.1
FAC
The Factual

The FACTUAL mood signifies that the factuality of the spe= aker=92s statement is certain and that there either is no underlying presup= position to the statement, or if there is, its factuality is also certain o= r has no bearing on the factuality of the statement. Examples:

His kids are ill. [i.e., i= t is known he has kids and it is known they are ill] &= nbsp;
{lo sei fatci panzi be do ku bilma sei fatci}

5.2.2
SUB
The Subjunctive
The SUBJUNCTIVE mood indicat= es that the factuality of an explicit or implicit presupposition underlying= the statement is certain, but the factuality of the speaker=92s statement = itself is questionable or uncertain, the specific nuance of factuality inte= nded being subject to the particular Bias and Validation associated with th= e verb. Corresponds roughly with English =91may,=92 =91maybe=92 or =91might= ,=92 with the added distinction that an explicit or implicit (i.e., underly= ing) presupposition is true. Examples:

Maybe his kids are ill. [i.e., it is known t= hat he has kids but it is not known whether they are ill]
{lo sei fatci pa= nzi be do ku bilma sei cumki}

5.2.3
ASM
The Assumptive
The ASSUMPTIVE mood functions identically to the FACTUAL= except that the factuality of an underlying presupposition is unknown. It = therefore conveys an act, state, or event whose factuality is dependent on = whether something else is factual, thus corresponding to certain usages of = English =91maybe=92 and =91will=92 (where =91will=92 primarily conveys poss= ibility, not future tense). As with all moods, the specific translation is = subject to the particular Bias and Validation associated with the verb. Exa= mples:

His kids=92= ll be ill OR If he has kids, they are ill. [i.e., it is unknown whether he ha= s kids, but if he does, they are certainly ill.]
{lo sei cumki panzi b= e do ku bilma sei fatci}

<= td width=3D"16%" style=3D"outline:0px;background-color:transparent">5.2.4
SPC
The S= peculative
The SPECULATIVE mood indicates that the factuality of both the presup= position and the statement itself are unknown. Its translation into English= is dependent on the specific context, sometimes corresponding to =91may,= =92 =91maybe=92 or =91might,=92 and at other times corresponding to the aux= iliary =91would.=92 Compare the examples below to those above:

Maybe his kids are ill&n= bsp;[i.e., it is unknown if he has kids but if he does, they may be ill].
<= /p>
= {lo panzi be do ku bilma sei cumki}

<= strong style=3D"outline:0px;background-color:transparent">5.2.5
CO= U
The Counterfactive
The COUNTERFACTIVE mood indicates that the factuality of the= underlying presupposition is false or unreal but that the factuality of th= e statement would otherwise be true. It thus corresponds to the English con= struction of auxiliary =91would=92 or =91would have=92 in its use to show c= ounterfactuality (i.e., what would have been if a false presupposition had = been true). Again, the specific translation is subject to the particular Bi= as and Validation associated with the verb. Compare the examples below to t= hose above.

His ki= ds would be (would have been) ill [i.e., if he had kids they woul= d be ill, but he doesn=92t].
{lo sei na fatci panzi be do ku bilma sei = fatci}

<= td width=3D"63%" style=3D"outline:0px;background-color:transparent">The Hypothetical
5.2.6
HYP
The HYPOTHE= TICAL mood indicates that the factuality of the underlying presupposition i= s false or unreal and that the factuality of the statement itself is uncert= ain. It thus corresponds to the English construction of auxiliary =91might = have=92 in its use to show possible counterfactuality (i.e., what might hav= e been if a false presupposition had been true). Again, the specific transl= ation is subject to the particular Bias and Validation associated with the = verb. Compare the examples below to those above.

His kids might=92ve been ill [if h= e had kids, but he doesn=92t, so we=92ll never know].
{lo sei na fatci pan= zi be do ku bilma sei cumki}

5.2.7
IPL
The Im= plicative
The IMPLICATIVE mood indicates that the factuality of the underlying p= resupposition determines the factuality of the statement and that the relat= ionship between the two need not necessarily be a direct cause-and-effect, = but merely an indirect chain of events from which the speaker infers the st= atement from the underlying presupposition. In grammatical analysis, this i= s referred to as an =93epistemic conditional.=94 Examples are shown below.<= /p>

His kids are (must be) ill [i.e., as implied by s= ome other fact such as his staying home from work].
{lo panzi be do ku bil= ma sei se sinxa}
{l= o panzi be do ku bilma sei se ve djuno}
<div sty...
Show original=

His kids are (must be) ill [i.e., as implied by some= other fact such as his staying home from work].
{lo panzi be do ku bilma sei se sinxa}
{lo = panzi be do ku bilma sei se ve djuno}

5.2.8
ASC
The Ascriptive
The A= SCRIPTIVE mood functions identically to the IMPLICATIVE immediately above, = except that the factuality of the inference derived from the underlying pre= supposition is uncertain. Examples:

= His kids may be = ill [i.e., as implied by some other fact such as his staying home= from work].
{lo panzi be = do ku bilma sei se sinxa sei cumki}
{lo panzi be do ku bilma sei s= e ve djuno&nbs= p;sei c= umki}

= ;

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To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com.
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