Received: from mail-pb0-f58.google.com ([209.85.160.58]:61556) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1TpW0C-000743-Bn; Sun, 30 Dec 2012 19:25:35 -0800 Received: by mail-pb0-f58.google.com with SMTP id xa7sf7490648pbc.3 for ; Sun, 30 Dec 2012 19:25:18 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=20120806; h=x-received:x-beenthere:x-received:x-received:received-spf :mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id :subject:to:x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results :reply-to:precedence:mailing-list:list-id:x-google-group-id :list-post:list-help:list-archive:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe :content-type; bh=rhgMvZwaH9bm3gYw9SJlkj+6t1lRuwcnw0UWZRVNm/Q=; b=N1a7sYcwFw+ft4bzFTXQftnbJAkJtQ4EmwRcH1UOzmLBkJVSaMvAuH51wy7e5pDMGl zVi36qenT6I5cSSni/nAmW0H0rgBuuqPYeI3f3w8jsbj2jtmI1Kwuqh08U4Qnx6/KoLU WrnElOFg9GXO3MJQQQyFES288mqzKsawXKBNi16/ajK80/lJipM4knH7y0h7QwucTKGw cDM6s22CF/ytM56wx5iuy4PnapNwcUoL7YynhcNYyXHYj5syuNSLkp6ltjHZZrOF/73/ LlhZlE0PnPm7WRWF2busu5RSiX8UbiwQx/cuxq2PvUGZjqdPx6hmK7O79pui/eKoeLxA 1XpA== DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=x-received:x-beenthere:x-received:x-received:received-spf :mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id :subject:to:x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results :reply-to:precedence:mailing-list:list-id:x-google-group-id :list-post:list-help:list-archive:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe :content-type; bh=rhgMvZwaH9bm3gYw9SJlkj+6t1lRuwcnw0UWZRVNm/Q=; b=ph+EjfOhMo6JLL+xpulZobaofRuOP+hB5dR1xmLtBkIBWcg3ZowFm4v98TLLgcR/4o l7P0YdD/42u+PGpsAwzny6T8d5N4cgW6PTKn2jGqmFMWYBsNmX0Oj5FQ+AWHr1bpFK8e wlUz+sAyBFiamOfW792GesaTxPk/iqBLgtwNorvrdJgO5ptsRFNp72nuS+XJqs0eUeH/ zSbg1/baC4U5fw9bmZRlIP+LI3fWsBCZGyp1/hnychyZmqza7FN426csWGhXpxE/dG/9 QE3/wKQ8yDnzsmTJ7FtHNgTshCTjCp+YafmevhT3sWsOM1WCklIzsCjMVNu6qPeEibHv +I9w== X-Received: by 10.50.196.135 with SMTP id im7mr13301210igc.1.1356924318205; Sun, 30 Dec 2012 19:25:18 -0800 (PST) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.50.88.130 with SMTP id bg2ls9304259igb.25.gmail; Sun, 30 Dec 2012 19:25:17 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 10.66.80.41 with SMTP id o9mr5904529pax.4.1356924317720; Sun, 30 Dec 2012 19:25:17 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 10.66.80.41 with SMTP id o9mr5904528pax.4.1356924317695; Sun, 30 Dec 2012 19:25:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-pb0-f44.google.com (mail-pb0-f44.google.com [209.85.160.44]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id uz6si7895265pbc.0.2012.12.30.19.25.17 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Sun, 30 Dec 2012 19:25:17 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of rpglover64@gmail.com designates 209.85.160.44 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.160.44; Received: by mail-pb0-f44.google.com with SMTP id uo1so6788606pbc.31 for ; Sun, 30 Dec 2012 19:25:17 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.68.219.36 with SMTP id pl4mr17667441pbc.124.1356924317604; Sun, 30 Dec 2012 19:25:17 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.68.15.70 with HTTP; Sun, 30 Dec 2012 19:24:57 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: From: ".arpis." Date: Sun, 30 Dec 2012 22:24:57 -0500 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] Secondary meaning of {cevni} To: Lojban X-Original-Sender: rpglover64@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of rpglover64@gmail.com designates 209.85.160.44 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=rpglover64@gmail.com; dkim=pass header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=047d7b2edc23f01a6804d21d8fdd X-Spam-Score: -0.1 (/) X-Spam_score: -0.1 X-Spam_score_int: 0 X-Spam_bar: / --047d7b2edc23f01a6804d21d8fdd Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Which is why I say misleading and not incorrect. Also, {la'oi Goa'uld cevni xu} by your definition (ignore if you haven't seen Stargate SG-1)? On Sun, Dec 30, 2012 at 9:17 PM, Jonathan Jones wrote: > On Sun, Dec 30, 2012 at 7:00 PM, .arpis. wrote: > >> Then I believe that the jbovlaste definition of {cevni} is misleading: >> >> Definition: x1 is a/the god/deity of people(s)/religion x2 with dominion >> over x3 [sphere]; x1 is divine. >> >> note the secondary definition. I would consider angels to be divine. >> > > Well, then you're using a different sense of the word "divine" than > jbovlaste is, because the sense of "divine" in the English definition of > {cevni} is "(of or pertaining to a god): deific, godlike, godly", whereas > you seem to be meaning "(eternal, holy): hallowed, holy, sacred". > > On Sun, Dec 30, 2012 at 8:38 PM, Jonathan Jones wrote: >> >>> Even demons, and if you stretch the meaning /really/ far, djinn. >>> >>> >>> On Sun, Dec 30, 2012 at 6:38 PM, Jonathan Jones wrote: >>> >>>> On Sun, Dec 30, 2012 at 1:28 PM, .arpis. wrote: >>>> >>>>> xu se cumki smuni lo ka ce'u ge angeli gi cevni >>>> >>>> >>>> {cevni} can refer to many different things, but not angels. Gods, >>>> goddesses, demi-god(esse)s, oni, and so on and so forth. >>>> >>>> But not angels. Angels are not gods, they aren't even god-like. Except >>>> for maybe the archangels, they're barely above humans, and in many ways are >>>> lower on the totem pole (like the complete lack of free will, emotion, or >>>> creativity, for example). >>>> >>>> -- >>>> mu'o mi'e .aionys. >>>> >>>> .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o >>>> (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D ) >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> mu'o mi'e .aionys. >>> >>> .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o >>> (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D ) >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "lojban" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> mu'o mi'e .arpis. >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "lojban" group. >> To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. >> > > > > -- > mu'o mi'e .aionys. > > .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o > (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D ) > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "lojban" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. > -- mu'o mi'e .arpis. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. --047d7b2edc23f01a6804d21d8fdd Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Which is why I say misleading and not incorrect.
<= br>
Also, {la'oi Goa'uld cevni xu} by your definition (ignore = if you haven't seen Stargate SG-1)?


On Sun, Dec 30, 2012 at 9:17 PM, Jonatha= n Jones <eyeonus@gmail.com> wrote:
On Sun, Dec 30, 2012 at 7:00 P= M, .arpis. <rpglover64+jbobau@gmail.com> wrote:
Then I believe that the jbovlaste definition of {cevni} is= misleading:
  Definition: x1 is a/the god/deity of people(s)/relig=
ion x2 with dominion
       over x3 [sphere]; x1 is divine.
note the secondary definition. = I would consider angels to be divine.

= Well, then you're using a different sense of the word "divine"= ; than jbovlaste is, because the sense of "divine" in the English= definition of {cevni} is "(of or pertaining to a god): deific, godlik= e, godly", whereas you seem to be meaning "(eternal, holy): hallo= wed, holy, sacred".

On Sun, Dec 30, 2012 at 8:38 PM, Jonathan Jones <eyeonus@gmail.com>= ; wrote:
Even demons, and if yo= u stretch the meaning /really/ far, djinn.


On Sun, Dec 30, 2012 at 6:38 PM, Jonathan Jones <eyeonus@gmail.com>= wrote:
On Sun, Dec = 30, 2012 at 1:28 PM, .arpis. <rpglover64+jbobau@gmail.com>= ; wrote:
xu se cumki smuni lo ka ce'u ge angeli gi cevni

<= /div>{cevni} can refer to many different things, but not angels. Gods, godd= esses, demi-god(esse)s, oni, and so on and so forth.

But not angels.= Angels are not gods, they aren't even god-like. Except for maybe the a= rchangels, they're barely above humans, and in many ways are lower on t= he totem pole (like the complete lack of free will, emotion, or creativity,= for example).

--
mu'o mi'e .aionys.

.i.e'ucai ko cmima lo piln= o be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o
(Come to the Dot Side! Lu= ke, I am your father. :D )



--
mu'o = mi'e .aionys.

.i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi= .luk. mi patfu do zo'o
(Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father= . :D )

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To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojba= n?hl=3Den.



--
= mu'o mi'e .arpis.

--
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--
mu'o mi'e .aionys.

= .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'= o
(Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )

--
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For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojba= n?hl=3Den.



--
mu'o mi= 'e .arpis.

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