Received: from mail-pa0-f56.google.com ([209.85.220.56]:61998) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1TqPu1-00086H-Lt; Wed, 02 Jan 2013 07:06:54 -0800 Received: by mail-pa0-f56.google.com with SMTP id rl6sf8968383pac.21 for ; Wed, 02 Jan 2013 07:06:39 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=20120806; h=x-received:x-beenthere:x-received:x-received:received-spf :mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post :list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe :content-type; bh=MMXqZOO/Nquw70o1+3pI50rGkC5mU3xqjmaeUCh3GEk=; b=cRDKthShzzJ4Qg7U7Ny8I3rQT6WOUpqpUkDz00rd+OqatBt/tdEqLLJPzjBbjr0W7T /tms7Hlvalp71j3LAAR9dZlTb13n5cMyqX3rq29SF9C5pjm6ji+GVaXewKMvOOQQf3Ke 9SKwdBXUpl2pQpiaXTLKYv346Uvssyg7P7CrExLB59XhykT5yvOlTxH5xzIVq3xBYxbc DYm5ud29DJ0p11rmCoXUCFCX4yavczRzdm9WzqtIAWZjzPeRl6FOQaaJO0rNZPPviJXO BKqJqON92bq1WnaV/TLWBZI2XdBZljJMKlaT6pO9eaoJBRH/Up7FqPtR1G4gh7ybtZ1C F5Cw== DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=x-received:x-beenthere:x-received:x-received:received-spf :mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post :list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe :content-type; bh=MMXqZOO/Nquw70o1+3pI50rGkC5mU3xqjmaeUCh3GEk=; b=KoCXSq9LEryvbgibpGTLKHVWZA72eHb77B5x1ZmaW1qF7mIz088DszaRiOWzNPnjT2 SqIxtOBxTt8Tm2Qn2awnjSG6wLYWz7ivUoNDtVdkZxTMl9KrDoizNtoOdBbdIcMXxYRV QdqqeHZhC23XBVpRCtQt8/5vSE2KBkpt5JpaPHBVDto4aUiBzaw+cwFvFqcgPRfrmhQG vycvUZ0oiLbI47VwwFQh5bE+HLID1PztJtnswV5p6bTe/T8BOf82wdtqU8dDoPIwWJe1 aTgB/P73JlFeLnfxsesIaYL5rnKUr5miohACXkPyQtzHQscVec2Kjbyp4RGv+vlPA7ww CGWg== X-Received: by 10.50.197.195 with SMTP id iw3mr14597980igc.10.1357139199680; Wed, 02 Jan 2013 07:06:39 -0800 (PST) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.50.188.170 with SMTP id gb10ls10649357igc.16.gmail; Wed, 02 Jan 2013 07:06:37 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 10.50.0.148 with SMTP id 20mr41223678ige.3.1357139197843; Wed, 02 Jan 2013 07:06:37 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 10.50.0.148 with SMTP id 20mr41223674ige.3.1357139197807; Wed, 02 Jan 2013 07:06:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-oa0-f44.google.com (mail-oa0-f44.google.com [209.85.219.44]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id s15si4193403igi.1.2013.01.02.07.06.37 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Wed, 02 Jan 2013 07:06:37 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of mturniansky@gmail.com designates 209.85.219.44 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.219.44; Received: by mail-oa0-f44.google.com with SMTP id n5so13189095oag.31 for ; Wed, 02 Jan 2013 07:06:37 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.182.21.135 with SMTP id v7mr38188682obe.101.1357139197619; Wed, 02 Jan 2013 07:06:37 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.182.186.98 with HTTP; Wed, 2 Jan 2013 07:06:37 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2013 10:06:37 -0500 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] strategic ambiguity of language From: Michael Turniansky To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: mturniansky@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of mturniansky@gmail.com designates 209.85.219.44 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=mturniansky@gmail.com; dkim=pass header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=14dae93b6374c8ee4804d24f97e6 X-Spam-Score: -0.1 (/) X-Spam_score: -0.1 X-Spam_score_int: 0 X-Spam_bar: / --14dae93b6374c8ee4804d24f97e6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Of course, since the lojban base sentence contains more than 7 words, we have a lot more possibilities for fun: mi no ba'e roi cusku le sedu'u ko'a zerle'a lo jdini pe mi (Why would you think I had said "nore'u"? That's just silly!) mi noroi cusku le se ba'e du'u ko'a zerle'a lo jdini pe mi (This one's a bit harder to justify. Although a construct like "...le se si'o ko'a jdini...." is grammatically fine, se du'u is basically the only thing that transforms bridi -> text, which cusku2 requires.) mi noroi cusku le sedu'u ko'a zerle'a lo jdini ba'e pe mi (In fact, what I said was "po mi"..) --gejyspa On Fri, Dec 28, 2012 at 6:22 AM, Remo Dentato wrote: > I agree that such "ambiguities" are important and I think it's a Lojban > plus to be able to reflect the same ambiguity. > > {mi noroi cusku le sedu'u ko'a zerle'a lo jdini pe mi} > > WIth the added benefit of being able to convey the disambiguation > grammatically (i.e. without resorting to typographical conventions like > bold) using {ba'e}: > > {ba'e mi noroi cusku le sedu'u ko'a zerle'a lo jdini pe mi} > {mi ba'e noroi cusku le sedu'u ko'a zerle'a lo jdini pe mi} > > etc. > > > > On Fri, Dec 28, 2012 at 9:58 AM, la gleki wrote: > >> Let me act as *la .ki'es.di'es.* a little :) >> >> >> http://mindyourdecisions.com/blog/2012/12/25/strategic-ambiguity-of-language/ >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "lojban" group. >> To view this discussion on the web visit >> https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojban/-/n59CmCju-NEJ. >> To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. >> > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "lojban" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. --14dae93b6374c8ee4804d24f97e6 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
=A0 Of course, since the lojban base sentence contains mor= e than 7 words, we have a lot more possibilities for fun:

=A0mi no ba'e roi cusku le sedu'u ko'a zerle'a lo jdini p= e mi (Why would you think I had said "nore'u"? That's jus= t silly!)
=A0mi noroi cusku le se ba'e du'u ko'a zerle'a lo jdin= i pe mi (This one's a bit harder to justify. Although a construct like = "...le se si'o ko'a jdini...." is grammatically fine, se = du'u is basically the only thing that transforms bridi -> text, whic= h cusku2 requires.)
=A0 mi noroi cusku le sedu'u ko'a zerle'a lo jdini ba'= e pe mi (In fact, what I said was "po mi"..)
=A0 =A0 = =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0--gejyspa
=A0

On Fri, Dec 28, 2012 at 6:22 AM, Remo Dentato <rdentato@gmail.com&g= t; wrote:
I agree that such &quo= t;ambiguities" are important and I think it's a Lojban plus to be = able to reflect the same ambiguity.

{mi noroi cusku le sedu'u ko'a zerle'a lo jdini pe mi}

WIth the added benefit of being able to convey the disambiguation gramm= atically (i.e. without resorting to typographical conventions like bold) us= ing {ba'e}:

{ba'e mi noroi cusku le sedu'u ko'a zerl= e'a lo jdini pe mi}
{mi ba'e noroi cusku le sedu'u ko'a zerle'a lo jdini pe mi}=

etc.



On Fri, Dec 28, = 2012 at 9:58 AM, la gleki <gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com> wrote:
Let me act as la .ki'es.di'es. a little :)

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