Received: from mail-pa0-f63.google.com ([209.85.220.63]:38967) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1Tscfm-0004sV-Fa; Tue, 08 Jan 2013 09:09:18 -0800 Received: by mail-pa0-f63.google.com with SMTP id bi5sf544738pad.28 for ; Tue, 08 Jan 2013 09:09:04 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=20120806; h=x-received:x-beenthere:x-received:x-received:received-spf :mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post :list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe :content-type; bh=31I9A0pLC5pDL9TI0Le1EusZZO9NWYbl44lqeZsyKKw=; b=MkfDZm42DuBztoCXuEmTiCyUQdMrvtl1/ObGTYq4NcT5kLrEzCR5fbU0FA41WIWrTp iE70Cc4+pQmsoRsmQyQjSL20Jeru6PCpH/C+i7RQz4bN1fn1Qnl5psm+tadwXl1G2r5m SodbrFh4zZCfbnfV9PbtqfF8f/IFzDvyxl5CVfVb1D7dUK3X0mf/L86WRGbmFxb99V+x RO11afplaCozEUYkDE8XF/1LrA8tq+m4zwGSG/C11HfGCHCQxbSeySkn2C5XvEfYyy73 WnBiN+S3C+eY0DNzh+J10g9DP8mOb4xpxcnx1EhjcYoUoN374fjct1wWyCNyOAPUKRUt hAlQ== DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=x-received:x-beenthere:x-received:x-received:received-spf :mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post :list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe :content-type; bh=31I9A0pLC5pDL9TI0Le1EusZZO9NWYbl44lqeZsyKKw=; b=MnT7Aea3qDJuTnTyS/RKr43AMMyWlDOVJ4xaLOiHCXFPAJbbgKleVZBro5tJTbh0Ur g3rJUZMLWkCUo4VNbckFxhQrTxLDoJQ6ALnah/4hh4fLV+hdCeM8z/wFANngDsk1z0dC MxAd+K+kLweDWKhPvmcdR9oqeV5yQxznTk7UfIOldJGMYOxaeVtHXVIxiHX70Qc048oi zRx2ztKrhxIf8oQqgupIs78sooUsgvfgFK0AKKJWAnjAJLfccgH3RYNkkJVZRysCSrNX 4bDb+V5GmIgCz/+i4dwvO/AKog77ZHa775o4igUbFNdiSbbJThPgt6Up31/TpbdymQ+u +QAA== X-Received: by 10.50.7.244 with SMTP id m20mr3731181iga.14.1357664944082; Tue, 08 Jan 2013 09:09:04 -0800 (PST) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.50.12.233 with SMTP id b9ls610384igc.4.gmail; Tue, 08 Jan 2013 09:09:02 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 10.42.212.209 with SMTP id gt17mr48166387icb.31.1357664942813; Tue, 08 Jan 2013 09:09:02 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 10.42.212.209 with SMTP id gt17mr48166386icb.31.1357664942801; Tue, 08 Jan 2013 09:09:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-ob0-f181.google.com (mail-ob0-f181.google.com [209.85.214.181]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id s15si860538igi.1.2013.01.08.09.09.02 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Tue, 08 Jan 2013 09:09:02 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of nictytan@gmail.com designates 209.85.214.181 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.214.181; Received: by mail-ob0-f181.google.com with SMTP id oi10so728003obb.26 for ; Tue, 08 Jan 2013 09:09:02 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.182.184.102 with SMTP id et6mr45085252obc.102.1357664942476; Tue, 08 Jan 2013 09:09:02 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.182.149.41 with HTTP; Tue, 8 Jan 2013 09:08:42 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: From: Jacob Errington Date: Tue, 8 Jan 2013 12:08:42 -0500 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] searching To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: nictytan@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of nictytan@gmail.com designates 209.85.214.181 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=nictytan@gmail.com; dkim=pass header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 X-Spam-Score: -0.1 (/) X-Spam_score: -0.1 X-Spam_score_int: 0 X-Spam_bar: / Using Lojban as it is without changing anything, there is a convoluted way to use sisku as-is, like this: .i mi sisku lo ka lo mi ckiku cu zvati ce'u kei ro zo'e ne lo zdani This happens to make sisku actually means something more along the lines of "x1 checks if the function x2 applies to members of set x3". However, this means you can say {.i mi sisku tu'a lo mi ckiku} and leave out the x3, which is still a bit weird. There has been talk about chaning sisku to mean something like "x1 looks for object x2 in/at location(s) x3", but it's doubtful that a gismu will get changed. Otherwise, you were on the right track with troci+facki, but facki2 is indeed a proposition, but we can use an indirect question to help us out: .i mi troci lo ka facki lo du'u makau se zvati lo mi ckiku This form is fully compositional and can be made into a 100%* jvajvo: {selzvafaktoi} So in sum, if you want to keep sisku as it is (which isn't really so useful) you can say {.i mi sisku tu'a lo mi ckiku}. If you want sisku to change, use it with its alternate definition: {.i mi sisku lo mi ckiku}. If you want to use a lujvo to avoid sisku altogether, use {.i mi selzvafaktoi lo mi ckiku}. .i mi'e la tsani mu'o On 8 January 2013 11:50, Luke Bergen wrote: > Going through the gismu on memrise (awesome service by the way), and I got > to "sisku". > > Apparently I've been using this really core word completely wrong. I've > been using it like "mi sisku lo mi ckiku", when evidently x2 is a property > and x3 is a set.... of somethings? > > I'm kind of confused by this definition. So, if there is a set of > properties, and there is one property in that set which x1 seeks among that > set x3. > > I'm just a little confused about how this is meant to be used. > > Meanwhile, what do I say when I'm looking for my car keys? "mi troci co > facki lo ckiku"? > > Except, double checking to make sure that I've got that right, even that > seems wrong since to "facki" is to discover a fact about a subject/object. > I guess an object's location is a fact about it.... but still.... I just > want to find my damn car keys, how do I say that?! > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "lojban" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en.