2013/1/14 Sebastian Fr=F6jd <so.coo= l.ogi@gmail.com>

Here's a link to my project of translating latin names of plants into l= ojban. Please contribute!
Sorry for a lot of swedish comments in the doc= ument. It was meant only as private notes from the beginning, but I now thi= nk it's better to publish it on internet like gleki did with his projec= ts.

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B_nLFjv5QIE9YTZ5MU9= pM2lpUkU/edit

mu'omi'e jongausib

2013/1/14 jongausib &l= t;so.cool.ogi@gm= ail.com>

If there's someday is going to be a comp= lete, official lojban=20 dictionary, I think there's a need for some criteria for what jbovlaste= =20 should contain and in which form.

Right now the dictionary is rather= finite, but with more contributors it could expand to an extreme extent.I think it's a good idea to discuss this issue now, so I don't co= ntribute with a lot of valsi now, and then a few years later someone delete= a lot of my work, because they don't fit into some future official tem= plate or list of criteria.

Vocabulary
1. Should we try to add lujvo for all places of ea= ch gismu as distinct valsi, like {seldri}, {selbai}, {terni'i} etc?
=
2. What kind of cmene/cmevla should be added? (with no restriction this= set could be extremely large)

For example, we could add recommendation that you only should add cmene= that could be regarded as having a lexicographical value, like the most co= mmon names of persons, companies, geographical entities etc. Not the name o= f the street where you are living and shit like that.

3. What kind of fu'ivla should be added?

With ALL names of s= pecies and chemical substances and other large sets, we are going to have a= very huge dictionary.
I've been trying to translate some names of s= pecies into lujvo (the solution I prefer), but the latin names are often no= t very descriptive and/or logical, so I think one of the better solution (a= t least for names of species etc, you use relative often) is to just lojban= ize the latin names into fu'ivla.

You'll probably already discussed this a lot, but it would be nice = to have some guidelines documented somewhere about standards. I believe loj= ban standards about biology, chemistry, music theory and other scientific d= isciplines, doesn't belong to the official grammar of lojban (as little= as Oxford style manual is normative for ALL kind of English language), but= still it would be nice to have such guidelines (on a level below the offic= ial language). Especially jbovlaste need such guidelines if we don't wa= nt to have an inconsistent dictionary with a dukse of words in a possible f= uture.

4. When is it ok to add a stage-4 fui'vla in the dictionary?
I know some lojbanist don't like stage-3 fu'ivla. I do like stage-= 3. The prefix in the stage-3 fu'ivla help you understand a little what = this foreign word is about. And you could make distinctions easily between = for example {spatrvanila}, {grutrvanila} "vanilla pod", {tsijrvan= ila} "vanilla seed" and {xukmrvanila} vanillin.

The only stage-4 fu'ivla I add are those which are very cultural sp= ecific, not easily constructed as a lujvo and/or which doesn't easily f= it into some cathegory. Stage-4 fu'ivla should also be useful. CLL says= : "[stage-4] are used where a fu'ivla has become so common or so i= mportant that it must be made as short as possible."

But as long as you don't add stage-4 without cause (what's the = cause of making {konjaku} a stage-4 for example? I've never heard of th= is species before), I think those fu'ivlas could really give a good fla= vor to the language, even if this at the same time means that we're goi= ng to learn a lot of inconsistent words just like learning natlangs. But st= age-4 fu'ivlas could be really cool, my favourites are {iklki} and {fi&= #39;ikca}.

Form
I think jbovlaste should have a consistent format before= publishing a printed version. Some poor fellow would therefore have to rea= d through all jbovlaste and edit it into a consistent format just before pr= inting. But if we would have guidelines from now on already, and we all add= valsi in the same way, there are going to be less work for someone in the = future.

1. Form of definition
Which format do you think should be standard?<= br>
{nerkla}:
a. n₁=3Dk₁ enters n₂= =3Dk₂ from origin k₃ via route k₄ using me= ans/vehicle k₅

b.x1=3Dn₁=3Dk₁ enters x2=3Dn₂=3Dk_=
2 from origin x3=3Dk₃ via route x4=3Dk₄ using m= eans/vehicle x5=3Dk₅

c. x1 enters x2 from origin x3 via r= oute x4 using means/vehicle x5

2. Etymology
I suggest that we don't add etymology info in the n= otes, but use the "add etymology"-link in jbovlaste.

I thi= nk etymology should be mandatory for cmevla and fu'ivla, so you can dis= cuss which language to borrow from.
This is a paranthetical but important question if lojban has ambition to be= as cultural neutral as possible.
So one recommendation could be that yo= u always use latin for names of species, the language most related to the s= pecific cultural phenomena/object (or a derivate of languages if many cultu= res share the same phenomena/object, or in that case maybe esperanto).

3. How much info in the notes?

And also a final question: Is it = possible for a user to edit another user's notes in jbovlaste, to add i= nfo?

4. Experimental gismu/cmavo
I think that's BPFK job to c= onsider if these words ever are going to be official. How does the procedur= e looks like for this?

mu'omi'e jongausib

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