Received: from mail-ye0-f189.google.com ([209.85.213.189]:59094) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1UL4En-00012U-5h; Wed, 27 Mar 2013 21:15:10 -0700 Received: by mail-ye0-f189.google.com with SMTP id l8sf941241yen.26 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2013 21:14:46 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=20120806; h=x-received:x-beenthere:x-received:received-spf:mime-version :x-received:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post :list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe :content-type; bh=rbw70zgsgNyj0yc4ZcxmpdBHnCJNFDeBlzyBZ8RLGQQ=; b=i9HBkLqELEz2jZ8B6IYURcLVP8kgY5SOkmgBnhr7jilyo8dyp1G4TfUReXhLScxWdZ gYJcm+Mr+A4S6gdWIGMbc2K/KigzTIK2/qnZXA1a9GytQ5L7yHPqxjpHzGZ7gg8EGvy8 sQzHJMzSy5xKQrlXvM4I4iUIdo8p0eEZhFbaUBnVcA0iXq3Q3R8nb78xppiaV0q/Epoq z8Lu+F9OpYhk4RQ+2xNravxOEzk3TMzDrn20dyudG3BZOwzL1stu5QeoZw0ZAR81lYhf j30bQUwSoGdwAV2b7dcHuPsA7NZNAVFJUfWqqCMo1QYS4x+eJaPJXI84b+jhhS7rFT48 mWyA== DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=x-received:x-beenthere:x-received:received-spf:mime-version :x-received:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post :list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe :content-type; bh=rbw70zgsgNyj0yc4ZcxmpdBHnCJNFDeBlzyBZ8RLGQQ=; b=EygAb+95wI5/C1wIxhRB/aML8IzUxLQ/leKo13DMQ7UvliNFcM0JTyH7ag5FqA3iXJ eo06LrdtNHfCNfCrXdeguHVxVqH5DsRL2sbfw9XHZGce8aHC96puYSeg/8Pi+hu0d0s8 OePYD0i3mHV37ZazsN205JxGs3JwUaTunPI+s2XEsM5TEHbjvBTuWCDIUV5zdQd9eqpa TOflc2W/C/jBq5PIYH+BZ2COzwALGRMEXtm2dP85O5vb0eLNV1QX5+bCBIEIZlvwh+0S ZUxM2x2/PWtjSQEiW1OgbVmXmXlNwETrJX+JQdrhiUtxjYVXgwwRG6ePADMilCp1i0jm XafQ== X-Received: by 10.50.33.175 with SMTP id s15mr1741238igi.8.1364444085949; Wed, 27 Mar 2013 21:14:45 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.50.140.102 with SMTP id rf6ls1379738igb.10.canary; Wed, 27 Mar 2013 21:14:45 -0700 (PDT) X-Received: by 10.42.38.134 with SMTP id c6mr17358935ice.14.1364444085378; Wed, 27 Mar 2013 21:14:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ie0-x232.google.com (mail-ie0-x232.google.com [2607:f8b0:4001:c03::232]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id hn12si647063igb.3.2013.03.27.21.14.45 (version=TLSv1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Wed, 27 Mar 2013 21:14:45 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of blindbravado@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4001:c03::232 as permitted sender) client-ip=2607:f8b0:4001:c03::232; Received: by mail-ie0-f178.google.com with SMTP id bn7so8622972ieb.23 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2013 21:14:45 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.50.184.132 with SMTP id eu4mr6005111igc.19.1364444085254; Wed, 27 Mar 2013 21:14:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.231.237.84 with HTTP; Wed, 27 Mar 2013 21:14:45 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <414a3bcb-4faa-49e3-be0e-9c05ea957574@googlegroups.com> References: <9cb76aa0-a82f-490f-befe-faeb69060888@googlegroups.com> <414a3bcb-4faa-49e3-be0e-9c05ea957574@googlegroups.com> Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2013 00:14:45 -0400 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] A Discussion of the Lojban System of Place Structure From: Ian Johnson To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: blindbravado@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of blindbravado@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4001:c03::232 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=blindbravado@gmail.com; dkim=pass header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=14dae9340ebd0480ab04d8f465ee X-Spam-Score: -0.1 (/) X-Spam_score: -0.1 X-Spam_score_int: 0 X-Spam_bar: / --14dae9340ebd0480ab04d8f465ee Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 That {mi poi zilkarbi} thing gets into the "as" issue that we had previously; I'm pretty skeptical as to whether it's appropriate. mi'e la latro'a mu'o On Wed, Mar 27, 2013 at 11:49 PM, la gleki wrote: > > >> mi zmadu do lo ni barda (I exceed you in property of being big) => mi poi >>>>> zilkarbi do cu barda (I compared to you is big). >>>>> >>>> >>>> ka, not ni. ni is quantity, ka is property. >>>> >>>> >>> Although this is completely unrelated to the thread -- then again so is >>> your reply, too -- the abstraction suggestions in the gimste are not >>> prescriptive. >>> >> >> I know this. I'm a big proponent of same. >> >> >>> (You can dig around the archives to see that Lojbab himself has said >>> this.) >>> >>> Some of us have adopted a system of abstractions that is more >>> self-consistent, and indeed, that system puts a quantity abstractor in >>> zmadu3. What gleki said isn't wrong; it simply doesn't conform to your >>> style of Lojban. >>> >> >> Actually, no. It is wrong, because he is translating ni as property. "(I >> exceed you in property of being big)". I wasn't saying he needed to put a >> property there, I was saying that ni is /not/ a property., it's a quantity. >> > > Yes, I was abviously wrong. .i .u'u > The correct translation > > mi zmadu do lo ni barda (I exceed you in quantity of being big) > > => mi poi zilkarbi do cu barda (I compared to you is big). > (However, I'm not sure if the second sentence is about properties of > qunatities). > > > >>> .i mi'e la tsani mu'o >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "lojban" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>> an email to lojban+un...@**googlegroups.com. >>> To post to this group, send email to loj...@googlegroups.com. >>> >>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/**group/lojban?hl=en >>> . >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/**groups/opt_out >>> . >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> mu'o mi'e .aionys. >> >> .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o >> (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D ) >> > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "lojban" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. --14dae9340ebd0480ab04d8f465ee Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable That {mi poi zilkarbi} thing gets into the "as" issue that we had= previously; I'm pretty skeptical as to whether it's appropriate.
mi'e la latro'a mu'o

On Wed, Mar 27, 2013 at 11:49 PM, la gleki <gleki.is.my.name@gmai= l.com> wrote:
=A0
mi zmadu do lo ni barda (I exceed you in property of being big) =3D>= ; mi poi zilkarbi do cu barda (I compared to you is big).

ka, not ni. ni is quantity, ka is property.


Although this is completely unrelated to the thr= ead -- then again so is your reply, too -- the abstraction suggestions in t= he gimste are not prescriptive.

I know this. I'm a big proponent of same.=A0
(= You can dig around the archives to see that Lojbab himself has said this.)= =A0

Some of us have adopted a system of abstractions that i= s more self-consistent, and indeed, that system puts a quantity abstractor = in zmadu3. What gleki said isn't wrong; it simply doesn't conform t= o your style of Lojban.

Actually, no. It is wrong, because he is transl= ating ni as property. "(I exceed you in property of being big)". = I wasn't saying he needed to put a property there, I was saying that ni= is /not/ a property., it's a quantity.

Yes, I was abviously wro= ng. .i .u'u
The correct translation=A0

mi zmadu do lo ni barda (I exceed you in quantity of being big)=A0

=3D> mi poi zilkarbi do cu barda (= I compared to you is big).
(However, I'm not sure i= f the second sentence is about properties of qunatities).



.i mi'e la tsani mu'o=A0

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--
mu'o mi'e .aionys.

.i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pi= lno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o
(Come to the Dot Side! = Luke, I am your father. :D )

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=A0
=A0

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