Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2013 06:36:19 -0700 (PDT)
From: la gleki <gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: [lojban] nu+roi question
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On Thursday, April 18, 2013 4:26:05 PM UTC+4, xorxes wrote:
>
>
>
> On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 10:35 PM, Ian Johnson <blindb...@gmail.com<javascript:>
> > wrote:
>
>>  I see {lo nu pa roi broda} as "an event of broda happening once", and 
>> {lo nu so'o roi broda} as being {loi [so'o] nu pa roi broda}, more or less.
>>
>
> Yes, more or less. In the same way that a place with many trees can be 
> seen as many places each with a single tree. 
>  
>
>  "N roi" always needs an (implicit or explicit) interval in which the 
>>> times are counted. In my example, the implicit interval was each weekend. 
>>> You can always make it more precise, at the usual price of using more 
>>> words. "I hate it when you fight once (in a weekend)". 
>>>
>> I don't think that changes much when you consider the plurality of the 
>> {lo nu} sumti; shift the interval around the right way and you get what I 
>> am thinking of. Using the ROI sumtcita functionality could probably achieve 
>> what you're thinking of less ambiguously, however; assuming it magically 
>> does what you're thinking is probably why I thought this was "incomplete" 
>> in the first place.
>>
>  
> Why appeal to magic? "mi xebni ro nu do pa roi damba" is compatible with a 
> situation in which I would like you to fight more than once. There's no 
> magic involved in that compatibility, it is perfectly reasonable for the 
> "pa roi" to be the focus of the hate. "I hate when you fight" is not so 
> compatible with that situation. As I see it, the English-Lojban pairings:
>
> I hate when you fight
> mi xebni ro nu do damba
>
> I hate when you fight once
> mi xebni ro nu do pa roi damba
>
> are better pairings than the pairing:
>
> I hate when you fight
> mi xebni ro nu do pa roi damba
>
> mu'o mi'e xorxes
>
>


Just a small note. I found these two sentences in Tatoeba. But there are 
many more of them. I could spam the mriste with numerous examples of 
problems that are real problems. But isn't it better that you start 
translating the sentences y'allself?
You can start with this http://tatoeba.org/eng/sentences/of_user/CK/page:55

*p.s. yes, "y'allself", it's a more precise word.*

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<br><br>On Thursday, April 18, 2013 4:26:05 PM UTC+4, xorxes wrote:<blockqu=
ote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0;margin-left: 0.8ex;border-left=
: 1px #ccc solid;padding-left: 1ex;"><div dir=3D"ltr"><br><div><br><div cla=
ss=3D"gmail_quote">On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 10:35 PM, Ian Johnson <span dir=
=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"javascript:" target=3D"_blank" gdf-obfuscated-mailt=
o=3D"FUCqa4GjziYJ">blindb...@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><span style=3D"color:r=
gb(34,34,34)">&nbsp;I see {lo nu pa roi broda} as "an event of broda happen=
ing once", and {lo nu so'o roi broda} as being {loi [so'o] nu pa roi broda}=
, more or less.</span><br>
</div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>Yes, more or less. In the same=
 way that a place with many trees can be seen as many places each with a si=
ngle tree.&nbsp;</div><div>&nbsp;</div><div><br></div><blockquote class=3D"=
gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-=
left:1ex">
<div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div><blockquote class=3D"=
gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-=
left:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div>
"N roi" always needs an (implicit or explicit) interval in which the times =
are counted. In my example, the implicit interval was each weekend. You can=
 always make it more precise, at the usual price of using more words. "I ha=
te it when you fight once (in a weekend)".&nbsp;</div>

</div></blockquote></div><div>I don't think that changes much when you cons=
ider the plurality of the {lo nu} sumti; shift the interval around the righ=
t way and you get what I am thinking of. Using the ROI sumtcita functionali=
ty could probably achieve what you're thinking of less ambiguously, however=
; assuming it magically does what you're thinking is probably why I thought=
 this was "incomplete" in the first place.</div>
</div></div></div></blockquote><div>&nbsp;</div><div>Why appeal to magic? "=
mi xebni ro nu do pa roi damba" is compatible with a situation in which I w=
ould like you to fight more than once. There's no magic involved in that co=
mpatibility, it is perfectly reasonable for the "pa roi" to be the focus of=
 the hate. "I hate when you fight" is not so compatible with that situation=
. As I see it, the English-Lojban pairings:</div>
<div><br></div><div>I hate when you fight</div><div>mi xebni ro nu do damba=
</div><div><br></div><div>I hate when you fight once</div><div>mi xebni ro =
nu do pa roi damba</div><div>
<br></div><div>are better pairings than the pairing:</div><div><br></div><d=
iv>I hate when you fight</div><div>mi xebni ro nu do pa roi damba</div><div=
><br></div><div>mu'o mi'e xorxes</div>
<div><br></div></div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div><br></div=
><div><br></div><div>Just a small note. I found these two sentences in Tato=
eba. But there are many more of them. I could spam the mriste with numerous=
 examples of problems that are real problems. But isn't it better that you =
start translating the sentences y'allself?</div><div>You can start with thi=
s&nbsp;http://tatoeba.org/eng/sentences/of_user/CK/page:55</div><div><br></=
div><div><i>p.s. yes, "y'allself", it's a more precise word.</i></div>

<p></p>

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