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Date: Fri, 03 May 2013 11:08:59 -0400
From: Robert LeChevalier <lojbab@lojban.org>
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Subject: Re: What is official? (Was: [lojban] Why is there no noodle gismu?)
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selpa'i wrote:
> Does "recognized" mean accepted as official? As far as I can tell, not
> even xorlo is immune to changes or future no-votes. From the "BPFK
> Procedures" page:
>
> "A poll is attached to the proposal page, where people vote to indicate
> their approval of the proposal. Voters may change their vote at any time."

Those are polls for the baseline description proposals, one for each 
chunk that the cmavo were divided into.  The polls are not final votes, 
because they are only partial.
Since the BYFY baseline description pages are not supposed to represent 
changes to the language, but rather documenting the baseline, the 
proposals constitute pieces of the whole.

There is NO provision for the BYFY to consider changes to the language 
OTHER THAN as required to document the baseline.  It is understood that 
when the baseline is completed, then such changes will be considered, 
but what procedures the BYFY will use hasn't been decided.

The BYFY's sole job is to define the baseline.

> Anyone who was allowed to vote back then can change their mind and vote
> no today, so technically, the BPFK has not made any final decisions
> about anything. Yet, xorlo seems commonly accepted (though not generally
> liked) and gets described as "official".
>
> (The xorlo proposal got changed relatively recently, in December 2011.)

The xorlo proposal was adopted by a formal vote by the membership, if I 
recall, circumventing the BYFY process.  It is not subject to change 
without another formal vote.

> I think it's problematic to cling to a baseline that is over a decade
> old.

Then people need to get things in gear and get the thing documented.

> Lojban has evolved considerably in the meantime, and doing it this
> way, the documentation might never catch up.

Lojban OFFICIALLY has not changed, regardless of whether people are 
willing to accept this.  This allows for evolution in semantics and 
usage as people become more fluent, and growth of the non-baselined 
lujvo and fu'ivla lexicons as well as experimental cmavo, but not for 
changes in that which constitutes the baseline.

No one is authorized to even *consider* formal changes until the 
baseline is documented.

As you have just seen, if someone uses non-standard language, I won't 
recognize/understand it, and I suspect that many others won't either, 
because they learned the language from the official documents and not 
from the wiki.  I'm not going to log onto the website every time I use 
the language to see what new concoction someone has proposed.

And my understanding is that people want the language to continue to be 
constrained to the formal definition, even after the baseline period has 
ended, which was not my original intent.  It needs to be accepted that 
the formal language will *always* lag those who want to experiment with 
new proposals.

lojbab


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