Date: Thu, 30 May 2013 23:02:31 -0700 (PDT)
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Subject: Re: [lojban] cmevla as a class of brivla
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On Friday, May 31, 2013 1:54:38 AM UTC+4, v4hn wrote:
>
> This pretty much sounds like you don't want=20
>
> {lo selpa'i karce} to possibly mean {lo karce pe la selpa'i}.=20
>

I don't want that to be expandable that way either. Otherwise I like the=20
merge.
=20

>
>
> v4hn=20
>
> On Thu, May 30, 2013 at 11:29:28PM +0200, selpa'i wrote:=20
> > la .van. cu cusku di'e=20
> > >Actually since someone first told me that brivla are allowed=20
> > >cmene I always disliked even that quite a lot. It's too easy to confus=
e=20
> > >these "names" with the bridi meaning.=20
> >=20
> > Then how do people not get confused about someone being called Amado=20
> > or Aim=E9? And even if they do, I'm confident that you can tell apart=
=20
> > {la} from {lo}, which are even clearer.=20
> >=20
> > >Nothing against you selpa'i,=20
> > >but you're definitely not my beloved and if e.g. {coi selpa'i} leaves=
=20
> > >this open, I'm pretty pissed.=20
> >=20
> > On IRC at least, {coi broda} is considered the same as {coi le=20
> > broda}, not {coi la broda}.=20
> >=20
> > To me, {coi selpa'i} greets someone beloved, not someone named=20
> > "selpa'i". If you want to greet me, say {coi la selpa'i} or I won't=20
> > assume you mean me.=20
> >=20
> > >Also in NatLangs not having this distinction=20
> > >can introduce formal ambiguities for colloquial speech (german: "Der=
=20
> Mueller=20
> > >ist zuverlaessig" - {la OR lo mlopre cu se lacri}).=20
> >=20
> > But not in Lojban. We have la and lo to disambiguate.=20
> >=20
> > >I strongly agree with la lojbab on that one:=20
> > >brivla are nicknames, NOT proper names.=20
> >=20
> > I don't see why that should be so. Seems quite arbitrary.=20
> >=20
> > >If you wish to make them names, use cmene that look similar=20
> > >or end in non-final rafsi.=20
> >=20
> > My name is "selpa'i" and nothing else. I do not identify with any=20
> > other string of letters. My name is not {.selpa'is.} and also not=20
> > {.selpam.}, those are entirely different names.=20
> >=20
> > mu'o mi'e la selpa'i=20
>

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<br><br>On Friday, May 31, 2013 1:54:38 AM UTC+4, v4hn wrote:<blockquote cl=
ass=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0;margin-left: 0.8ex;border-left: 1px =
#ccc solid;padding-left: 1ex;">This pretty much sounds like you don't want
<br>
<br>{lo selpa'i karce} to possibly mean {lo karce pe la selpa'i}.
<br></blockquote><div><br></div><div>I don't want that to be expandable tha=
t way either. Otherwise I like the merge.</div><div>&nbsp;</div><blockquote=
 class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0;margin-left: 0.8ex;border-left: 1=
px #ccc solid;padding-left: 1ex;">
<br>
<br>v4hn
<br>
<br>On Thu, May 30, 2013 at 11:29:28PM +0200, selpa'i wrote:
<br>&gt; la .van. cu cusku di'e
<br>&gt; &gt;Actually since someone first told me that brivla are allowed
<br>&gt; &gt;cmene I always disliked even that quite a lot. It's too easy t=
o confuse
<br>&gt; &gt;these "names" with the bridi meaning.
<br>&gt;=20
<br>&gt; Then how do people not get confused about someone being called Ama=
do
<br>&gt; or Aim=E9? And even if they do, I'm confident that you can tell ap=
art
<br>&gt; {la} from {lo}, which are even clearer.
<br>&gt;=20
<br>&gt; &gt;Nothing against you selpa'i,
<br>&gt; &gt;but you're definitely not my beloved and if e.g. {coi selpa'i}=
 leaves
<br>&gt; &gt;this open, I'm pretty pissed.
<br>&gt;=20
<br>&gt; On IRC at least, {coi broda} is considered the same as {coi le
<br>&gt; broda}, not {coi la broda}.
<br>&gt;=20
<br>&gt; To me, {coi selpa'i} greets someone beloved, not someone named
<br>&gt; "selpa'i". If you want to greet me, say {coi la selpa'i} or I won'=
t
<br>&gt; assume you mean me.
<br>&gt;=20
<br>&gt; &gt;Also in NatLangs not having this distinction
<br>&gt; &gt;can introduce formal ambiguities for colloquial speech (german=
: "Der Mueller
<br>&gt; &gt;ist zuverlaessig" - {la OR lo mlopre cu se lacri}).
<br>&gt;=20
<br>&gt; But not in Lojban. We have la and lo to disambiguate.
<br>&gt;=20
<br>&gt; &gt;I strongly agree with la lojbab on that one:
<br>&gt; &gt;brivla are nicknames, NOT proper names.
<br>&gt;=20
<br>&gt; I don't see why that should be so. Seems quite arbitrary.
<br>&gt;=20
<br>&gt; &gt;If you wish to make them names, use cmene that look similar
<br>&gt; &gt;or end in non-final rafsi.
<br>&gt;=20
<br>&gt; My name is "selpa'i" and nothing else. I do not identify with any
<br>&gt; other string of letters. My name is not {.selpa'is.} and also not
<br>&gt; {.selpam.}, those are entirely different names.
<br>&gt;=20
<br>&gt; mu'o mi'e la selpa'i
<br></blockquote>

<p></p>

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