Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of seladwa@gmx.de designates 212.227.17.20 as permitted sender) client-ip=212.227.17.20;
Message-ID: <51B06D24.6020102@gmx.de>
Date: Thu, 06 Jun 2013 13:06:12 +0200
From: selpa'i <seladwa@gmx.de>
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 5.1; rv:17.0) Gecko/20130509 Thunderbird/17.0.6
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: lojban@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [lojban] cmevla as a class of brivla
References: <CAHxnAmJvBZ1_4S1OF45n3dd5g2iQmFEGiQbsyBTN6PwybsNkrA@mail.gmail.com> <51A379EF.3020803@gmx.de> <CAHxnAm+HZGvy=Ck9nvogsR_uHL=+BYPho6vDKe8WGp-H4xKmEA@mail.gmail.com> <51A6685C.3010505@lojban.org> <CAMKwHj3gpou-t-6wPOLP7TCXdGhVGU2z+H-z4g=yGJK8Yg2gEg@mail.gmail.com> <51A8680E.7040103@lojban.org> <CAMKwHj3+aWwW0E3QP271aRNP8oKMy9hNDipjypX6hhJkauM+_A@mail.gmail.com> <51A8F326.2020901@lojban.org> <51A8F89D.2040408@gmx.de> <51B00097.8080004@lojban.org>
In-Reply-To: <51B00097.8080004@lojban.org>
Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com
Precedence: list
Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com
Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
X-Spam_score: 0.0
X-Spam_score_int: 0
X-Spam_bar: /

la .lojbab. cu cusku di'e
> selpa'i wrote:
>> la .lojbab. cu cusku di'e
>>> What semantic distinctions arise from identifying
>>> something as a name as opposed to a normal description, I am not sure
>>> (but it would surely encompass the relevant place structures).
>>
>> But {la} doesn't describe. It names. I don't describe Jacob Errington as
>> a sky when I call him by la tsani, and neither does he describe himself
>> as a sky by giving himself that name. It's merely a label used to refer
>> to this individual, nothing more.
>
> But "tsani" itself is grammatically a brivla, and implicit
> (grammatically) in "la tsani" is "la tsani be ...".  The places are
> inseparable from the brivla.  That is fundamental to the language.

I agree that places are inseperable from a brivla in that the places are 
what the brivla means. All the places together determine the meaning, 
and usually, if one or more places aren't present, the meaning of the 
brivla is different. When I use {tsani}, I must be aware that it relates 
a sky to the place it's a sky of. *That* is fundamental to the language.

However, you seem to be saying that {la tsani} and {la tsani be zo'e} or 
{la tsani be da} are all people that share the exact same name. And this 
is where I disagree.

mu'o mi'e la selpa'i

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.