Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of blindbravado@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4001:c03::22f as permitted sender) client-ip=2607:f8b0:4001:c03::22f;
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <1370830982.63258.YahooMailNeo@web184401.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>
References: <CAHxnAmJvBZ1_4S1OF45n3dd5g2iQmFEGiQbsyBTN6PwybsNkrA@mail.gmail.com>
	<51A379EF.3020803@gmx.de>
	<CAHxnAm+HZGvy=Ck9nvogsR_uHL=+BYPho6vDKe8WGp-H4xKmEA@mail.gmail.com>
	<51A6685C.3010505@lojban.org>
	<CAMKwHj3gpou-t-6wPOLP7TCXdGhVGU2z+H-z4g=yGJK8Yg2gEg@mail.gmail.com>
	<51A8680E.7040103@lojban.org>
	<CAMKwHj3+aWwW0E3QP271aRNP8oKMy9hNDipjypX6hhJkauM+_A@mail.gmail.com>
	<51A8F326.2020901@lojban.org>
	<51A8F89D.2040408@gmx.de>
	<51B00097.8080004@lojban.org>
	<51B06D24.6020102@gmx.de>
	<51B46762.8080509@lojban.org>
	<51B47305.4020704@gmx.de>
	<CAHxnAmLDUzkGG14rFY9i-TUoOsBwEobXzj+dRV5GOZ-zqg2LNg@mail.gmail.com>
	<1370811519.81380.YahooMailNeo@web184403.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>
	<CAO7tK2fwYJQcj9QPZ4Bo7r+yYE-B9-gauEWWHg8CPFNE_hU9MA@mail.gmail.com>
	<1370813476.27765.YahooMailNeo@web184405.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>
	<CA+gZtgKe_m8+sbokF2X6UtHzqh6LP9qk64NTDYp1SpYzzdcAog@mail.gmail.com>
	<1370830982.63258.YahooMailNeo@web184401.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>
Date: Sun, 9 Jun 2013 22:28:27 -0400
Message-ID: <CA+gZtgJyXrgQmewdd-9gVMwRDG3Ci4DRH3BWuwMbo8GZgyzqzA@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [lojban] cmevla as a class of brivla
From: Ian Johnson <blindbravado@gmail.com>
To: lojban@googlegroups.com
Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com
Precedence: list
Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com
Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=089e014953e026aa6204dec3891c
X-Spam_score: -0.1
X-Spam_score_int: 0
X-Spam_bar: /

--089e014953e026aa6204dec3891c
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

On Sun, Jun 9, 2013 at 10:23 PM, John E Clifford <kali9putra@yahoo.com>wrote:

> Alas, what you say may be practically correct, but is logically wrong.
> All predicates must have all arguments in place.  If we omit some at the
> surface level, they have to be restored uniquely at some level before
> interpretation.  At the moment, Lojban does not have a way of doing this.
> As you note, following CLL, sometime there just isn't something for that
> slot -- which means, of course, that we have the predicate wrong, if not
> the other places.  On the other hand, when there is something there, we
> have no clear way of saying what should go there: the obvious value (I
> suppose this is sorta {zo'e}) or the any value that makes the whole true
> (presumably {da}), but no rule as to which to pick (and {zo'e}'s use here
> does not fit well with its use in "definitions" of gadri).
>
This is outright incorrect as it pertains to Lojban. {zi'o} exists to build
new semi-nonce predicates that don't include places of existing predicates.

mi'e la latro'a mu'o

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.


--089e014953e026aa6204dec3891c
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr"><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On S=
un, Jun 9, 2013 at 10:23 PM, John E Clifford <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:kali9putra@yahoo.com" target=3D"_blank">kali9putra@yahoo.com</a>=
&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div><div style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-famil=
y:times new roman,new york,times,serif">Alas, what you say may be practical=
ly correct, but is logically wrong.=A0 All predicates must have all argumen=
ts in place.=A0 If we omit some at the surface level, they have to be resto=
red uniquely at some level before interpretation.=A0 At the moment, Lojban =
does not have a way of doing this.=A0 As you note, following CLL, sometime =
there just isn&#39;t something for that slot -- which means, of course, tha=
t we have the predicate wrong, if not the other places.=A0 On the other han=
d, when there is something there, we have no clear way of saying what shoul=
d go there: the obvious value (I suppose this is sorta {zo&#39;e}) or the a=
ny value that makes the whole true (presumably {da}), but no rule as to whi=
ch to pick (and {zo&#39;e}&#39;s use here does not fit well with its use in=
 &quot;definitions&quot; of gadri).=A0
 <br></div></div></blockquote><div>This is outright incorrect as it pertain=
s to Lojban. {zi&#39;o} exists to build new semi-nonce predicates that don&=
#39;t include places of existing predicates.<br><br></div><div>mi&#39;e la =
latro&#39;a mu&#39;o<br>
</div></div></div></div>

<p></p>

-- <br />
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups &=
quot;lojban&quot; group.<br />
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e=
mail to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.<br />
To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.<br />
Visit this group at <a href=3D"http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=3De=
n">http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=3Den</a>.<br />
For more options, visit <a href=3D"https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out=
">https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out</a>.<br />
&nbsp;<br />
&nbsp;<br />

--089e014953e026aa6204dec3891c--